crown
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Post by crown on May 9, 2015 20:34:41 GMT -5
Seriously I need to know this. Aside from a heavily truncated Fortress destruction/breakup scene Thau used hardly any of the Donner footage shown in the various TV edits of SII? And yet Thau decides to use a $hitty screen-test and a re-used $hitty ending? What was Thau thinking? ?
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zuperman
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Post by zuperman on May 10, 2015 0:28:17 GMT -5
You should view it a second time. There is text at the beginning that explains that it was not the same ending. Troll.
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atp
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Post by atp on May 10, 2015 4:05:46 GMT -5
I wonder how much Donner footage Mr Thau found and did not put in the RDC.
I have a hard time believing many of those scenes were really final. They look and feel like dress rehearsals and outtakes.
Was that really Donner's best stuff?
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zuperman
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Post by zuperman on May 10, 2015 4:12:31 GMT -5
People screamed for years that Lester had sabotaged Donner's movie by touching SII. Donner says it's his vision at the beginning. So, it's his vision or not his vision? Either it's his vision and it's crap or he sold out = WB gave him a cool million to put his name on a poop movie.
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Post by crazy_asian_man on May 10, 2015 10:59:40 GMT -5
I wonder how much Donner footage Mr Thau found and did not put in the RDC. I have a hard time believing many of those scenes were really final. They look and feel like dress rehearsals and outtakes. Was that really Donner's best stuff? I think with fan cuts giantly improving the performances (and seeing SII under Baird/Victor-Smith and Baird/Thau)--- I think it shows just how much editing goes hand in hand with directing. Sadly, Thau's editing choices almost did as much damage as Lester! (Unintentionally) Many of the alternate takes that Thau decided to replace in scenes that were shot by Donner and edited by Baird also are a head scratcher... That's why it really would have been nice to have a Thau commentary detailing changes and why they were made (perhaps in spots the originals were damaged too much? Or there was a disagreement with Donner and Thau over bits to keep?) Donner reportedly was a perfectionist, so multiple takes of everything was probable. One thing that bothered was Thau's interview where he kept asking for 'faster faster' takes- which, in the bit where Clark goes back to the FOS- doesn't make a lot of sense.... unless what DOnner had in mind to shoot originally (and probably so) BEFORE Clark gets into the FOS made more sense. I got the feeling from that particular sequence, Donner would have had shot Clark being exhausted, then getting a burst of energy once he saw the FOS. But, that mini-monologue that Clark gives about his Kryptonian heritage I had always read as being played slow and mournful- the way it was played felt rushed. If Donner really only supervised it (or gave advice) in a rush- and his approach to including Lester's stuff was 'make the whole thing move as fast as possible'- and it looks that way- then it feels more like SIV in editing, than anything else. And it kind of does, sadly. Maybe a Donner & Salkind edit (as was suggested before) might have had each other kill each other, but I think it might have made a better final RDC.
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atp
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Post by atp on May 10, 2015 11:06:58 GMT -5
Yes, director and editor are two sides of the same coin.
I didn't realise until recently just how much the editor was responsible for creating.
Things would probably be so much better if a single human being could be the writer, director and editor!
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Post by crazy_asian_man on May 10, 2015 11:14:43 GMT -5
Yes, director and editor are two sides of the same coin. I didn't realise until recently just how much the editor was responsible for creating. Things would probably be so much better if a single human being could be the writer, director and editor! Robert Rodriguez does that..... to mixed results.
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Post by supes81 on Jul 8, 2015 5:57:26 GMT -5
I wonder how much Donner footage Mr Thau found and did not put in the RDC. I have a hard time believing many of those scenes were really final. They look and feel like dress rehearsals and outtakes. Was that really Donner's best stuff? I scratch my head at some decisions. Gene hackman's flubbed line "Too true to be good" how did that make it in there. I just saw the International cut with the same scene with the correct line reading, also prior to that "They need a contact.....here on earth" is an awkward line reading with the space there, in the International Cut it flows so much better. They didn't go through everything, they couldn't have. I think they found what they needed and looked no further, either that or Thau actually thought that was good acting on Hackman's part. Thau I am sure said they were pressed for time, which shows in the editing. If that's the case I don't believe they went through everything, which makes me wonder what else might be there. I would work for free to go through every last bit of Lester and Donner footage and put something together, they wouldn't even need to credit me.
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Jul 10, 2015 18:53:58 GMT -5
I wonder how much Donner footage Mr Thau found and did not put in the RDC. I have a hard time believing many of those scenes were really final. They look and feel like dress rehearsals and outtakes. Was that really Donner's best stuff? I scratch my head at some decisions. Gene hackman's flubbed line "Too true to be good" how did that make it in there. I just saw the International cut with the same scene with the correct line reading, also prior to that "They need a contact.....here on earth" is an awkward line reading with the space there, in the International Cut it flows so much better. They didn't go through everything, they couldn't have. I think they found what they needed and looked no further, either that or Thau actually thought that was good acting on Hackman's part. Thau I am sure said they were pressed for time, which shows in the editing. If that's the case I don't believe they went through everything, which makes me wonder what else might be there. I would work for free to go through every last bit of Lester and Donner footage and put something together, they wouldn't even need to credit me. The dumbest move that Thau made was not just leaving alone what wasn't broken in the edits that were made by Baird before, and just build from there... especially if in a rush. *sigh*
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