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Post by adam15 on Apr 3, 2009 17:31:30 GMT -5
STM: 100%
SII: 80%
SIII:60%
SIV:0%
Donner Cut: 55%
SR: 35%
Overall average of Superman films: 100+80+60+0+55+35/6= 55% or F!!!!!!!
This board is as much a SIV board as it is a STM board. Therefore when looking at the Superman films in a holistic analysis, the only conclusion is that they should be ridiculed to the nth degree!
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Apr 3, 2009 17:37:13 GMT -5
SR wasn't cheap. Even you gotta know that.
And we don't lump the films together and talk about them in every discussion when talking about quality.
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Post by adam15 on Apr 3, 2009 17:43:05 GMT -5
Oh SR was cheap in the sense that it was unoriginal. The writers were too mentally cheap to come up with original ideas!
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Post by MAVERICK on Apr 3, 2009 17:49:30 GMT -5
You're absolutely right.
Superman Leaving earth to find Krypton
Superman saving a Jet in the most spectacular Superman stunt ever caught on film
Lex Building a Crystaline Island
Lex kicking the dogsnot out of a powerless Superman
Superman Having a Son
All of those ideas were already used in other Superman movies......right?
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Legsy
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Post by Legsy on Apr 4, 2009 0:39:55 GMT -5
Very cheap and unoriginal.
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ye5man
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Post by ye5man on Apr 4, 2009 11:22:05 GMT -5
Oh SR was cheap in the sense that it was unoriginal. The writers were too mentally cheap to come up with original ideas! Agreed; though Mav brings up valid points, there was waaaaaay too much rehashing of the original. I can't believe how much original dialogue was used. |
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Post by MAVERICK on Apr 4, 2009 12:46:04 GMT -5
I like the dialog repeats. It catches the noobs up to speed about what was great in the Donnerverse.
I'm betting that there would be very little of it in a sequel, since SR is a Re-Introduction to the Donnerverse, the sequel could then be more of its own thing. So, I dont mind the rehashing. Love it actually.
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ye5man
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Post by ye5man on Apr 4, 2009 16:02:58 GMT -5
lame excuse. It should stand on its own.
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Post by stargazer01 on Apr 4, 2009 16:15:07 GMT -5
I like the dialog repeats. It catches the noobs up to speed about what was great in the Donnerverse. I'm betting that there would be very little of it in a sequel, since SR is a Re-Introduction to the Donnerverse, the sequel could then be more of its own thing. So, I dont mind the rehashing. Love it actually. Exaaaactly.  And I love it too. |
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Post by MAVERICK on Apr 4, 2009 18:17:30 GMT -5
lame excuse. It should stand on its own. Lame to you. I happen to love it. And I like that it relies on the Donnerverse instead of standing on its own. |
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The Phantom Menace
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Post by The Phantom Menace on Apr 4, 2009 18:26:30 GMT -5
I thought Returns was able to stand on it's own well enough. When I saw in theaters, I had only seen the first film once in it's entirety (and had yet to see the remaining Reeve Superman films at all).
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Post by stargazer01 on Apr 4, 2009 18:39:33 GMT -5
I thought Returns was able to stand on it's own well enough. When I saw in theaters, I had only seen the first film once in it's entirety (and had yet to see the remaining Reeve Superman films at all). I agree. I hadn't seen the first two movies in yeaaars (never bought them till after SR), and I was also able to understand the plot/story in SR just fine. I actually don't think that there is that much STM dialogue reused in SR. People exagerate a lot of times. |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Apr 4, 2009 19:09:29 GMT -5
Nothing wrong with acknowledging the past or building on tradition. otherwise you get Lois & Clark  |
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Legsy
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Post by Legsy on Apr 4, 2009 19:16:53 GMT -5
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Post by KaptainKrypton on Apr 5, 2009 5:33:27 GMT -5
I've been called a lunatic and possibly even a heretic, but I'm in the microscopic minority that thinks that a salvageable film could be cobbled out of Superman IV. That is, if it were given the Lucas treatment and the visuals were completely facelifted and some clever editing was done. To those who doubt what could be done? Look at what Selutron did with a mishmash of stuff when he made those scenes for his proposed combo picture. Still doubt it, then? Well, you probably do, but I still love the film for what it could be...and definitely not for what it is. I still love the performances given by the cast of core players and Reeve carries the show on his back, as usual. Man, I've got to stop thinking about this...it's been FAR too long.
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Post by KaptainKrypton on Apr 5, 2009 5:37:36 GMT -5
I agree. I hadn't seen the first two movies in yeaaars (never bought them till after SR), and I was also able to understand the plot/story in SR just fine. I actually don't think that there is that much STM dialogue reused in SR. People exagerate a lot of times. Definitely. Because of a few choice lines that were lifted, some people like to make it seem as if SR was 2006's rendition of Gus Van Sant's Psycho. Those same people should also be pissed off because Perry happened to mutter "Great Caesar's Ghost" during one scene. I don't know about all the other Superfans out there...but I never want to see any correlating themes in any franchise I watch...ever.  |
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ye5man
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Post by ye5man on Apr 5, 2009 6:45:57 GMT -5
And I like that it relies on the Donnerverse instead of standing on its own. The concepts are not mutually exclusive. Rehashing dialogue is always lame in this way and brings noone up to speed (if anything bringing people "up to speed" in SR is controversial cos of Singer's self proclaimed it kind of follows on from STM and S2, but not completely. If anything, it makes people think of the far superior original. See: SW prequels and superfluous characters appearing just because they were in the OT. |
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Post by MAVERICK on Apr 5, 2009 13:32:50 GMT -5
Rehashing dialogue is always lame I disagree. I LOVED it. Other people did too. I can agree with that. Its really for fans who already know it. Some people. For many others, its a loving homage in a long overdue re-visit to the Donnerverse. Also, I guess I should clarify what I mean by my statement where I said: I like that it relies on the Donnerverse instead of standing on its ownI'm one of those guys who laughs when people say that a sequel should be a movie that stands on its own & that you shouldn't have had to have seen the previous installments to get everything. I HATE that mindset. In fact the sequels I like the most are the ones where if you hadn't seen the previous movie, you'd be lost. Like Lord Of The Rings. I remember someone saying that they didn't like the sequels because they couldn't be seen & understood by a new viewer if that viewer hadn't seen the previous movies. GOOD! I say! If you didn't see the previous installments then you deserve to be lost when watching a sequel. Go rent them first LOL! However, I understand that SR is a bit of a different beast. In fact, It works for BOTH kinds of viewers. It works much better, to me, if you have seen STM & SII, because its a sequel. However, It also seems to have worked for MANY people who never even saw part I & II. So, to me, its win for both parties: If you have seen I & II & know SR is a sequel, then you get all the homages & it makes it even richer. If you have not seen the other films, this movie really stands well enough on its own through the text origin tale at the beginning & the Smallville flashbacks & the dialog that lets you know whats been going on with Superman that catches you up to speed. To me, thats Singer's genius. Making it work as a Sequel for those who know the Donnerverse, & at the same time making it work as a standalone film for those who are seeing Superman for the first time in their life, on screen. Just my opinions ofcourse. |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Apr 5, 2009 13:35:30 GMT -5
SR works well enough on its own that seeing the other films isn't an absolute requirement.
Even if your just basically familiar with Superman's lore in general you can pick it up. krypton blew up, Jor-El's his dad, he can fly (or jump really high) and saves people. Thats basic to ALL version of Superman.
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Post by MAVERICK on Apr 5, 2009 13:37:58 GMT -5
Agreed.
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Post by stargazer01 on Apr 5, 2009 13:52:37 GMT -5
SR works well enough on its own that seeing the other films isn't an absolute requirement. Even if your just basically familiar with Superman's lore in general you can pick it up. krypton blew up, Jor-El's his dad, he can fly (or jump really high) and saves people. Thats basic to ALL version of Superman. And Superman loves Lois. And Lex Luthor hates Superman. Also, personally, I don't think STM is far superior to SR. STM is a wonderful Superman origin movie that still works, no doubt, but it has its share of flaws; the villains are too campy and corny and there are some ploth holes. So, flawless, it isn't. |
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Legsy
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Post by Legsy on Apr 5, 2009 13:58:51 GMT -5
STAR, HOW DARE YOU! You're no longer my friend.  I JUST KIDDING! ;D |
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Post by MAVERICK on Apr 5, 2009 14:19:23 GMT -5
Also, personally, I don't think STM is far superior to SR. STM is a wonderful Superman origin movie that still works, no doubt, but it has its share of flaws; the villains are too campy and corny and there are some ploth holes. So, flawless, it isn't. Exaaaaaaaaaaaaaaactly. |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Apr 5, 2009 14:26:22 GMT -5
STM's a great movie but its not flawless and its not the end all be all of Superman.
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Post by adam15 on Apr 6, 2009 10:41:43 GMT -5
It's funny everyone debated whether or not SR was gonna be a direct sequel or "vague" sequel. No one thought we'd basically get a remake of STM. Anyone who can't see the striking similarities between STM and SR (which goes WAY beyond just the rehashed dialog) needs to gets their eyes and ears checked! It's fine that people like SR (did I say that?!) but please don't try to pretend that SR wasn't what it was; an amateurish homage to STM. |
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And I love it too. 
