Not a CAM cut: ugh preview warnings

[EvilSupes]

Wow, I can see you've done a lot of work rotoscoping there. Dare I ask how long it took?

Are you adding any other new bits to the movie or just the metropolis fight?

I must say it looks really good CAM and I haven't been this excited about a fan cut since when I first heard Adywan was fixing the ESB to its original look. When can we expect to see it?

[matt]

Great work!!!

[TylerDurden389]

And another one is knocked outta the park. Good job CAM, you never fail to impress me. I'm actually glad that you mentioned how you're inspired by some of the things other fan cutters have done and would use scenes Selutron did for your own use. Now I can take the weight off my shoulders and admit to the same thing lol.

Without going into too much detail, my personal fan cut mirrors yours a lot (seeing as how I loved so many of your ideas), with some Sleutron bits, and also re-instating some stuff from the RIC. That being said, I'll put up some more things I've done.

Amazing how Thorn's "Lois jumps into the ravine" music has perfect timing with the Daily Planet jump isn't it? How it builds up like that I mean.

[EvilSupes]

Wow, some really exciting stuff there CAM. I really love the alternate shots you've done from either other material or rotoscoped in as it gives the audience more chance to take in the events.

However, I will say one thing and this isn't a criticism, this is just an idea, (and I think it will undoubtedly help this cut immensely) and that is you get another person on board to help you put this together. I only say that because I can see so much potential here, and I think it can be made into one of the best SII fan cuts ever and why not? I think having someone like Jimbo by your side helping you edit the cut together to help with the pacing and various things, would be really beneficial. Anyway it's just an idea.

[Kamdan]

I can't wait for this one. I've been DYING to see someone try to fit in Selutron's clips into a edit.

[Jor-L5150]

* MOON ATTACK*
Kept the coloring of the RDC, but restored frames that Thau trimmed out (!!!).
Still in the process of swapping out the bored Nasa technicians' room cutaways to a more intense Nasa room, with more extras in the background. (I get why Lester wanted to make it seem like noone notices the astronauts getting killed, but Mank's script implied it was to be darker when it cut to the Nasa techs)

exaaactly , if i was any good at this stuff the moon/nasa scene is the FIRST thing i would want to change , and i would look at mission control footage from " apollo 13 " for the panicked responce of mission control.

what footage did you/will you use ?

i think having nasa be aware of what is happening ( even watching it on monitors ) HELPS the story , as it quickly adds a sense of danger and we dont need to waste time in east huston.

if nasa was watching this , the pentagon and the white house would be called IMMEDIATELY , and we can get right to Zod's devastating take-over.

[EvilSupes]

CAM are the Selutron clips from capedwonder? because the quality is a little crappy if I remember correctly. Or do you have a better source?

Also, is the whole cut going to be dvd quality or more avi quality orientated?

Sorry for so many questions, I am excited!! ;D

[EvilSupes]

Yes, you so must CAM! I love your work!

Then, once you are finished with SII you can hurry up and work on SIV. ;D

[Jimbo]

Superman IV doesn't deserve the effort.

There is however an improved Superman IV cut out there I know about.

[/shameless plug]

[Jor-L5150]

Apr 16, 2009 10:15:15 GMT -5 crazy_asian_man said:

Hey Jorl-5150- good to hear from you!

exaaactly , if i was any good at this stuff the moon/nasa scene is the FIRST thing i would want to change , and i would look at mission control footage from " apollo 13 " for the panicked responce of mission control.

what footage did you/will you use ?

i think having nasa be aware of what is happening ( even watching it on monitors ) HELPS the story , as it quickly adds a sense of danger and we dont need to waste time in east huston.

I toyed with using "Armageddon" Nasa footage- and did a version of that, that I felt was semi-successful... with monitors getting an obscured view of what was going on, and then the panicked look of the Nasa technicians at the end- but the cinematography looked a little too different- too modern (although I heard that Nasa looks nothing like what's in Armageddon) and I think Selutron was right in trying to choose footage shot more/less around that time frame for matches, where possible.

It's funny that you bring up "Apollo 13", I did consider that footage, too- but- even though I understand Ron Howard went to great pains to make the Nasa control center as accurate as possible- "Capicorn One" I'm leaning more towards because the time frame it was shot in is closer to STM's - and the look is closer to SII's Nasa cc, but with more extras that look like they're concerned than in the theatrical SII. (Will try to put that in-progress bit up on youtube soon)

i'm not familiar with that film , but i am glad you are leaning towards what look likes a good match , i thought of apollo 13 as i thought it was close to the late 70's look you need to keep it consistant . armagheddon , imo , is too diefferent and would be hard to match up and look like it belongs.

[TylerDurden389]

I think the Clark dub does improve it, even if it's in present tense. Selutron's take on the scene had another line of Clark shouting 'Lois!!" Not sure which part of which film he got it from though. He was definitely shouting. Also, the shot of Clark looking down was MUCH farther away, you could barely see Clark looking out. So yours is def. and improvement over his.

[snoopkryptodog]

I have a question about the opening credits. Since you've already grabbed some of Selutron's work, would you consider using his opening time travel sequence. It fills a major gap in the first film, explaining why Lois still saw things blowing sky high even though Superman turned back time to save her. I found the missle sequence a little abrupt as you have it cut.

[Jimbo]

Selutron's opening can't be beat, really. It bridges the STM/S2 gap pretty well while trying to explain why there was still the earthquake after Superman turned the world around.

[Ollie W]

Apr 16, 2009 16:59:28 GMT -5 TylerDurden389 said:

I think the Clark dub does improve it, even if it's in present tense. Selutron's take on the scene had another line of Clark shouting 'Lois!!" Not sure which part of which film he got it from though. He was definitely shouting. Also, the shot of Clark looking down was MUCH farther away, you could barely see Clark looking out. So yours is def. and improvement over his.

As far as I could tell Selutron took the dialogue of Clark shouting ''Lois'' from the screen test. I tried to work the dialogue into my cut but it just never sounded right.

[Sverdlovski]

Wow, that's a lot of work! Congrats!

Apr 15, 2009 11:11:15 GMT -5 crazy_asian_man said:

WHITE HOUSE flag restoration, with wave fly by (Mav idea)
May try to roto a reaction shot of the president looking at Supes, something Lester shoulda done a pickup shot on, if it didn't exist.

UN wave flyby as well...
Showing that Supes is American, but is a world icon-

I know it's your version and everything, but I'd like to make a comment on this.

IMO, the diner revenge scene is the best scene of the movie, and the movie should end with the flyby right after it, like the Thau Cut.

But, because Thorne's score during that scene culminating with Supes going to the White House is so good, and because in Lester's version Supes doesn't turn the time back, thus the damages Gal Zod and co caused to the world are still there, Supes going to the White House is a good way of showing that Superman is helping mankind to rebuild all that was vandalized by the three Kryptonian villains.

I just don't like the look Superman gives at the American flag right after talking to the president. It's a look of "oh, how awesome is this flag? So AWESOME, fuck yeah!". I've always disliked Superman showing patriotism (I dislike the very notion of 'patriotism'... but anyway, that's another story). And specially after a movie where they say the villains took over the world, but what we see is that they arrived at the small American city, went to the White House and the U.S. president surrended in the name of all the nations in the world, whose leaders he had the decency of consulting.

Er... so, just like Thau borrowed some frames from A Few Good Men to show the destruction of another American monument, it would be cool if someone made a cut containing some footage of non-US cities being destroyed by Zod. For example, in the movie Children of Men, there's a montage at the beginning showing cities around the world falling apart; that could be borrowed by the editor and included in his cut of SII. In the clips you posted, CAS, I see that you put some footage showing people watching, on TV, Superman battling the villains. So, I think it would be interesting if you put that a scene where a TV newscaster announces that Zod and co. caused havoc around the world. Maybe even include a snipet showing Soviet generals not knowing what to do (and there's plenty of movies with scenes like that!).

But I think showing Superman waving to the UN building is unecessary. If you put a scene where the villains destroy the world (and not just the United States), the last scene of the movie (Superman returning the flag to the WH) would serve to show that Supes is helping people to rebuild the world destroyed by Zod, and it's not just an act of patriotism.

Because the diner scene is the best scene of the movie, anything after that is just filler, the less the better, so that the movie can end on a high note.

[Kirok]

I suggested "Capricorn One" as a possible source for alternate NASA footage before, but I'm not sure when or to whom. It would definitely match SII a lot better than a modern film like "Armageddon" or "Apollo 13," not to mention be much less recognizable. I'm glad that you're taking it into consideration, CAM.

[Kirok]

I would suggest Netflix. A flat rate allows you to rent as many movies a month as you want, and considering regular rental prices (not to mention theater prices) it's a great deal. Not just for fan editing resources, but entertainment too! I don't have Netflix myself, though I've considered it, so maybe someone who does have it could fill you in on more details.

[Jor-L5150]

I think that one of the saving graces of Superman IV is that he shows the he loves the people of the world, and it's not restricted to one country.

I took Superman's look towards the flag and his love of the U.S. in a similiar vein in how one would have great affection for the town that they grew up in. It might have it's flaws, as all towns do, but overall, there's a sense of loyalty and indebtness to wherever he/she grew up in, if it was a positive experience.

So, I take it as a character aspect. Taken too far, and Superman can be taken as a propaganda symbol (as mentioned in good detail in the Superman documentary produced by Bryan Singer) for the left or the right wing politics.... which becomes problematic to enjoy, once Superman becomes an endorsement for a particular set of politics, rather than a larger-than-life character who's also symbol for hope and life who happens to love America.

So, his looking towards the flag and loving it, I saw more as Supes loving the fact that the place that his rocket ship landed on and called home hasn't been destroyed and taken over; as well (of course) other countries. I can see how it can be read otherwise, but I prefer it to be his love for earth in general that makes him happy to see one symbol of his homeplace restored to how it was before Zod took over.







............eexxxxaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaacctly.

[adam15]

But Superman explicitly says that he is here to fight for the American Way... how else can you read that? Even in SIV he first straightens the American Flag before saving the world.

[Jimbo]

More like he adjusted the flag just before radically shifting the position of the Moon, causing enormous tidal damage to many coastal dwellers.

Millions died.

[Jor-L5150]

Apr 17, 2009 14:53:35 GMT -5 Jimbo said:

More like he adjusted the flag just before radically shifting the position of the Moon, causing enormous tidal damage to many coastal dwellers.

Millions died.

dahahahahahahahh ;D ;D

[adam15]

The American way is the way of opportunity and freedom. Of a free press and freedom of religion (not from religion.) The American way is the right to keep and bear arms and have a government that peacfully transfers power. The American way ended slavery, our men and women saved the world in WWII, and our free market capitalistic principles made us the lone superpower that took us to the moon, and is today advancing the cause for freedom in the Middle East.

Democrats and Republicans squabble over a litany of issues... but at the end of the day we are all proud Americans because our history is like no other on Earth... it is the best!

Superman fights for what America is all about!

[Ollie W]

Apr 17, 2009 2:18:46 GMT -5 crazy_asian_man said:

I still am curious to see your cut, Ollie W! (I've read your treatment- sounded great & isn't there a positive review in fancut.org?)

The review was positive however the reviewer felt the audio quality was lacking as a result of the process I used to mix down the 5.1 soundtrack to 2.0.

I'm hoping to have my revised version all finished by the end of this month.

[atp]

Apr 16, 2009 23:05:07 GMT -5 Sverdlovski said:

it would be cool if someone made a cut containing some footage of non-US cities being destroyed by Zod. For example, in the movie Children of Men, there's a montage at the beginning showing cities around the world falling apart; that could be borrowed by the editor and included in his cut of SII. In the clips you posted, CAS, I see that you put some footage showing people watching, on TV, Superman battling the villains. So, I think it would be interesting if you put that a scene where a TV newscaster announces that Zod and co. caused havoc around the world. Maybe even include a snipet showing Soviet generals not knowing what to do (and there's plenty of movies with scenes like that!).

I agree totally. We need that scene.

If you put a scene where the villains destroy the world (and not just the United States), the last scene of the movie (Superman returning the flag to the WH) would serve to show that Supes is helping people to rebuild the world destroyed by Zod, and it's not just an act of patriotism.

Another good reason to have that scene and not just the Esat Houston Idaho stuff.

[EvilSupes]

The moon attack is brilliant! However CAM! I think you should've cut straight after you had Houston going chaotic rather than back to Zod and co at the moon discussing their powers. I think it would've been a more interesting cut away. Plus, it leaves you with a feeling over 'WTF just happened?" I don't think the audience really need to know that Zod and co are getting powers from our Sun - we already know they have powers like Superman by the way they tore up the moon.

Just some ideas.

By the way, that's the best opening for SII I've ever seen!