Not a CAM cut: ugh preview warnings

[Jor-L5150]

Aug 11, 2009 2:56:45 GMT -5 crazy_asian_man said:

UPDATE: TUESDAY august 9th, 2009:
New bit: Full first draft re-assembly of the rooftop confrontation, with 'new' dialogue for General Zod and inserting the news helicopter. Does it work for you? Let me know, thanks again!
www.youtube.com/watch?v=StlNoC0qo9A

ok-

at first i was iffy about zod repeating the offer h emade to jor-el , but actually i think it works- he's like a sith trying to corrupt the house of el.

at about :58 , zod takes awhile to look up and see the concrete wall- i dunno - does it have to take him that long to look up ?

at about 1:35 we see superman down lower , looking exhausted and this is the shot where he will later ( pretend to ) run away- but its here as well- personally ( this is just my 2 bits ) i like the straight cut from superman's heat vision exploding the wall then right to him slugging it out.

nice work though - you rock.

[TylerDurden389]

So glad to see a new clip CAM. I'm happy you've found use of some of the IRC footage. I also like how you've found a way to use the shots of Supes looking distressed, since you're cut will have him flying away with the shot from S3.

However, as far as Zod repeating his speech from part 1, I understand what you're going for (heck, had Donner finished part 2, he'd have probably done the same thing), but since we're stuck using the same footage from part 1, it's probably better to leave it alone. I'm also not crazy about Superman punching Non into the building so quickly. The chase scene is good to build up to it.

And while I've never had a problem with your re-powering edit, I agree with Jor-L5150. A quicker recap without using all the dialogue from part 1 would work better.

Anyway, great job here. Just make sure you take out that woman shouting "You can't leave us!!"

Btw, Jor-L5150, I take it your a Van Halen fan? I am too.

[Jor-L5150]

Aug 11, 2009 15:07:15 GMT -5 TylerDurden389 said:

And while I've never had a problem with your re-powering edit, I agree with Jor-L5150. A quicker recap without using all the dialogue from part 1 would work better.

Anyway, great job here. Just make sure you take out that woman shouting "You can't leave us!!"

Btw, Jor-L5150, I take it your a Van Halen fan? I am too.

heck yeah !!!
www.vhnd.com
the MIGHTY VAN HALEN RULES!!! and rumor has it , next spring will be a good time for us.....
chickenfoot is pretty wicked too

[TylerDurden389]

I'll try not to turn CAM's thread into a Van Halen tribute thread lol, but I will say this, wether it's Diamond Dave or The Red Rocker at the Helm, Van Halen is my favorite band EVER. I hope the rumor you're talking about is either A) A new album or B) another tour. Though I'm not holding my breath for it to be C) Sammy and Mike are rejoining the band, and we'll have a TRUE re-union album/tour. Can you imagine the ensuing chaos between Roth fans and Hagar fans? lol.

I've thought about seeing Chickenfoot as they'll be here in NY later this month, but since they're only playing their new music, I think I'll pass. Granted it's good stuff, but I'm not big on that blues-y rock. It just seems very diluted/lukewarm for my tastes. Though granted, in 2009 what else can they do besides "bar rock"? What with rap dominating the charts right now.

Joe Satriani is one of my favorite guitarists, and I was kinda hoping to kill two birds with one stone by seeing him, Sammy and Mike together playing all their classic stuff. Can you IMAGINE the Satch-man doing Eddie's "Eruption"? Well hopefully, they make a second album and then they do some of their solo stuff on the tour. I heard them say in an interview that they would.

[TylerDurden389]

Very ambitious stuff here CAM. It's great to see the military actually being a part of the battle now, as well as more reaction shots from the bystanders. Where did you get that footage from? It looks like something from the 70's so it definitely fits here.

I was gonna say maybe you're throwing TOO much stuff in here to amp up the battle scene (as I've said before, your first take on it that you made a while back was great already), but since you're gonna make 2 versions, now I'll say "Just run with it". Use as much footage from wherever just to get it as close to the original concept as possible.

I'll have to go back and read the script again, as I'm kinda confused about the military taking action as well, what with the president surrendering and all.

Anyway, great job man. Keep it up!! Oh, and once it's all said and done, I wanna see both versions lol.

[Jor-L5150]

i understand your angle at adding dimension to zod's character - it is a good approach.

on one hand , in STM he angrily shouts at Jor, " you will bow down.....bot you and then one day your ass ( i mean hiers ) "
so the precedent is there for Zod to want that (im)moral victory - corrupting jor's son and turning him against jor's camp.

on the other hand , when lex explains that " this ...superman " IS the son of jor-el zod has an emotional reaction " Let us CRUSH the son of our jailor ! " and " kill HIIIIMMM KILLL HH--HHIIIIIMMM"

so zod is a cold , calcualting guy- but not immune to irrational behaivor .
i like the idea of him trying to recruit the son of jor-el .

maybe - to keep it from being repetitive , you drop the " yours could become...second only to my own " and KEPT simply : " join us.. " where superman responds :" some how i just cant hear you "

i think thats some ironic snappy flippant conversation!! ;D


EDIT :

better yet!!

what if- zod STARTS the speech " join us , your could become a..."
and then superman completely INTERRUPTS HIM! " i just cant hear you zod "

oooh!! BURN!!

[Jor-L5150]

Aug 13, 2009 13:25:13 GMT -5 crazy_asian_man said:

UPDATE: THURSDAY august 13th, 2009:
New bit: ROUGH music mix, though- Restructuring of the Statue of Liberty fight, with soldiers defending the Statue of Liberty (even though I know that the president may have surrendered to Zod, would existing militia still try to defend the Statue? The Mank script has police officers still working/but would this compromise make any sense or too wrong to fit? )

Anyhow, here it is:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xjy4UFNZ5sA

ok , this is very good. i like most of it , some of it puzzled me .
- is the shot of a helicopter colliding with the statue from " batman forever " ?
- the shot at the end - why is the plane rolling ? i get that superman corrects the flightplan , but was caused the barrel roll ?
- good footage of military arming up , makes sense.
- when the general says " what are those men doing ..didnt they get my orders ? " ....maybe dialog hurts this scene , maybe the montage is better w/out dialog.
( its your baby do what YOU want )
- tea leoni is CUTE - but she takes me right out of it. i DO like that you show the media covering it and so forth though.
- i like the shot of zod and supes leaving the atmosphere and seeing the circle of the globe behind them .

[HOSNI]

GREAT work Cam.

Guys my understanding is we should be looking at this from the perspective of whats possible to ramp up the action and drama for the Metropolis battle, preferrably in a new Warners endorsed SII revisit.

Selutron - we know you're exhausted and a little over the project for the time being, but you need to be watching this stuff to get more ideas.

Example - simple as it may seem, how much better was the lead up to Zod slamming Supes? Keep it up CAM, the more continued awareness the better IMO.

[Jor-L5150]

Aug 13, 2009 18:41:29 GMT -5 Jor-L5150 said:

EDIT :

better yet!!

what if- zod STARTS the speech " join us , your could become a..."
and then superman completely INTERRUPTS HIM! " i just cant hear you zod "

oooh!! BURN!!

About your mentioning on how to re-edit Zod/Superman's exhange-- hilarious!
A 'comedy edit' would have the helicopter sound drowning out Zod--- then Superman smiling and saying: "Somehow I just can't hear you, Zod!"

actually , while i think it would be witty , i wasnt going for a zinger - i thought it would be cool to see superman so flippant with the concieted Zod-
like " how dare he talk to me that way "
but maybe it sounds campy - i dunno.

[EvilSupes]

CAAAAAAAAAAM!!!!

I've been away, I'm sorry I haven't seen your latest works. I've seen them now though, lol. Anyway, I really enjoyed your last clip, keep 'em coming!

[TylerDurden389]

Can't wait!!!

[albertd]

Great sound editing, cam!

[TylerDurden389]

Nice job there CAM. Me personally, Selutron's take on the screen test combined with the Lester footage is probably the best compromise. Aside from Margo looking prettier in Donner footage, I'd even go as far as to say that even her voice sounds nicer too. It seems like her voice in the Lester scenes are deeper (and considering the noises she makes when she's being pulled by the current, I don't think anyone will argue this).

Though you could argue Lois jumping into the water is more realistic than her firing a blank at Supes since he could've always just said "Uh, Lois, you realize that you just shot a blank right?"

[HOSNI]

well done Cam, sounds great.

[EvilSupes]

Sept 6, 2009 18:11:44 GMT -5 TylerDurden389 said:

Nice job there CAM. Me personally, Selutron's take on the screen test combined with the Lester footage is probably the best compromise. Aside from Margo looking prettier in Donner footage, I'd even go as far as to say that even her voice sounds nicer too. It seems like her voice in the Lester scenes are deeper (and considering the noises she makes when she's being pulled by the current, I don't think anyone will argue this).

Though you could argue Lois jumping into the water is more realistic than her firing a blank at Supes since he could've always just said "Uh, Lois, you realize that you just shot a blank right?"

She sounds like she's been smoking more. It wouldn't surprise if she was, I mean Donner got fired and in came Lester. It's bound to stress out the cast...

[EvilSupes]

Hey CAM have you ever thought about creating dolls of Zod and co and Supes and then filming them in front a green screen to get more shots of them flying?

[crazy_asian_man]

Hey CAM have you ever thought about creating dolls of Zod and co and Supes and then filming them in front a green screen to get more shots of them flying?

I actually did think about it--- but then, when I saw the footage of the professional miniatures in SII against backgrounds--- in both the theatrical and the Donner- decided against it. I also was going to have a friend (who can look like a young Sarah Douglas in the DOnner version) be shot in front of green screen..... but o man, I've spent SOOO much time on this project, (I'm even now still tweaking minor sound and fx bits), that I think I'm done with it for now.

Superman III, at this point, would be a lot easier to re-edit (and maybe even fun) by comparison, mixing in Supergirl to the mix.

[TylerDurden389]

I came up with another idea, or to be correct, I'm suggesting someone else's idea that was mentioned here on the boards. Someone said the alleyway change would be a great way to finish the movie because it has a "This looks like a job for Superman" feel to it. It wouldn't be the entire sequence, just the DP footage and ending with Superman taking off (although a new shot of him flying away would have to be sorted out).

IMO, had Donner finished part 2, chances are he wouldn't have re-hashed the same "Fly-by over the Earth" ending from the 1st film, and probably ended it something more like this.

[EvilSupes]

Hey no worries. We realise this is only a preview so we aren't expecting anything super perfect. I'm just grateful to be in the position of seeing some your well made put-together ideas. That'll do it for me. I mean, this is probably the best stuff any of us are gonna see with Superman II in a long, long time - that is if indeed Selutron's cut does ever appear in the future, so perhaps yours is the only decent stuff we'lll see?

[TylerDurden389]

I got it in the mail today, but I had an evening class, so although I watched the majority of the cut, I fast forwarded through scenes that were left alone/were not edited. My thoughts on this are going to be long. I mean like "You better sit down with a cup of coffee and clear your schedule long." I feel it's necessary to go over this bit by bit, which means when I get the chance (in a day or 2), I will watch it again and write down my opinions. I was originally going to send it just to CAM in a private email, but I dunno, would everyone here like to see my thoughts as well?

[crazy_asian_man]

Hey friends-
Was going to request the thread be deleted, as I was worried that WB might be upset over the fancut- and had a mild/wild panic & removed my posts/thinking it would remove the thread- but, calmer heads have convinced me that it's not a big deal....(thanx jim!). so, apologies for the freakout & so, for those who wanted a preview and wish to throw it up on this thread--- apologies for freaking out & leaving the thread as is from here. Thanx cam.

[crazy_asian_man]

Updated list of content/changes attempted:

0.1: Precredits;
Opens with documentary bits/edits of the actors (with Donner and Reeve) arriving for the SII premiere.
Crowd fills up. Drapes. Mainly to simulate (sorta) my own experience and anticipation when watching the first Supes movies..... half of the show was the anticipation and chatting up expectations with strangers who were also excited about what was going to be seen.

0.2: Dedication to Unsworth;
Why not Reeve? It's supposed to simulate the experience (sorta) of what it might have been like, had plans gone according to plan in 1978/1980.

0.3: New Comic Book Opening:
Was going to rotoscope the kids' hands, but it was hard enough trying to film/zoom in properly with Action Comics' #1 cover. Always dug the initial idea of the book starting/ending with a comic book.

0.4: Curtains open/Zoom into Krypton

0.5: Phantom Zone Trial
Mix of Donner/Lester....definitely reinserting... "Join us"....and trying to take in the best of the new shots in the RDC.

0.6: Lester/Thorne music/credit transition
A little goofy with Zod screaming (incredibly fast) "You willbowdownbeforemeIswearit-etc." as the Zone passes by/with green crystal.... but hearing it without it, sounds odd- so, attribute the sound kept in to preserving audio memory of the theatrical.

1.0: Credits/ Recap
Composited (roughly) the ORIGINAL STM credits, but new 'S2' lester shield. Picked out new footage to cover the span of Supes' life thus far, not just what Lester chose, in order, for the most part. Ends with Supes flying towards us after being saved by Teschmacher.

Also....original Documentary footage of the original Donner space images' background, that wasn't used but shot during STM. (the space thingees that float by in the original STM credits, so it truly is Donner stuff...)

2.0: Chasing Rockets/Villains escape
Got rid of the really bad starfield shots (though not all) for the PZ criminals. Mixed Lester/Donner, plus some composite shots of Supes hurling rocket away. No multiple explosions, just one. Kept "FREE"--- and extended it, to a pov zooming towards earth.

3.0: Daily Planet Jump/Opening
Restored/edited the cab smash into Clark.... part of this was in the Donner script, plus it gives more 'life' back to the environment surrounding the Daily Planet before Lois jumps into it. Painful searching for images of the (now changed) Daily Planet building for exterior pans to it and Lois' falling, a few rotoscopes, own shot footage of stairways, and Thorne music and insert pov shots. Tricky (haven't found a solution yet) to the extended screaming fx....I found one longer scream to insert, but...yah, the audio mixing is problematic in the part where Lois falls, need to get all the sound elements (or regenerate it) to remix/extend.

4.0: Lester Luthor Prison Scene
I like the pacing better than the RDC, and it's close enough to each other imo. Too much Luthor/Otis, didn't need, after all.

5.0: Transition to the Moon Attack
I used the Lester extra shots of a suprised Zod/trio to the moon, but am rethinking the 'lost look of Zod'--- maybe doesn't fit after his angry 'free' after all...

6.0: Moon Attack/Capicorn One
Rather than cut back and forth to the comedic Lester awfulness.... I tried to mix in Nasa from Capicorn One. No matter what, syncing the dialogue from the Lester Nasa operator doesn't match--- one day, I may re-record the dialogue and re-edit this. It's terrible how one second of off synch can linger and make a few terrible minutes readjusting afterwards. Bah.

But- I think it's overall ok- Recently readjusted music cues to make the transitions back and forth to the Nasa base smoother.

7.0: Takeoff from the Moon
Tyler reccomended reinserting the IRC lines here- as I reinsert some later, despite grainy footage... may well do that. After some experiment mixing the two, ended up choosing the Lester chosen takeoff with color tint.

8.0: Prison Escape Sequence
Although it has goofy sound fx, to me, it fits the goofiness of the (outdated) prison uniforms of Otis/Luthor, so I chose the theatrical choice, but added in the line of Otis remarking how they got in, plus a RDC shot of the balloon pov taking off.

9.0: Honeymoon Haven
Kept the whole thing. I've seen other cuts, where different trim choices are made, but this was one of the few scenes that didn't really bother me all that much by Lester... although it did piss me off more when I read the Mank script and saw how the tone was shifted improperly. But, prefer this whole scene to the truncated RDC--- TOO truncated.

10.0: Balloon over the arctic
Why not the Donner/nighttime balloon? Pacing is better with cutting back and forth- but I admit that scale-wise, I remember enjoying seeing the arctic backgrounds on the bigscreen initially, even if it wasn't intended that way. (Sorry Dick)

11.0: Niagara Rescue
Added a couple of new composites, though I need to (eventually) fix the kids' shirt from blue to red stripes. Fuzziness on one of the composites is necessary--- some of my composites are rougher than others, despite best efforts, and 'fuzzy edges' seemed to help here with the water background.

I like orange juice, never had a problem with it being there, even if the scene with the initial orange juice was removed.... I figure it's a character thing and didn't bother me. Fine either way, but as I grew up with the bit, I think the absence is more distracting than its presence.

12.0: Jorel/Luthor
Tried my best to get Jorel to look the way he did in STM, but simply couldn't achieve it, but this was my best shot. At least in blue, it's (to me) less offensive than the flesh-colored pasted floating head.

I also tried to minimize the floating head, through rotoscoping....though now it looks like something is floating THROUGH his head. Blame Thau for making this just about impossible to undo his damage.

At the end, I think I also flipped a shot and reassigned a Luthor line, so it avoided the toilet flush sound fx/ending.

13.0: Lois jump into water
Kept the whole, except for the dialogue reediting when Clark has his back turned to us.... I know, I know.... it's a little weird story compromise for Lois to suggest jumping again- but, just as I mentioned the weighing out of it being more or less distracting with this scene's removal, integrating the new screen test lines help me accept this....plus, Lois could have thought she was just INCREDIBLY lucky the first time around and Supes already knew she was going to be ok.

14.0: Transition
New transition fx shot added post-preview, of the villains approaching Earth/coming through the atmosphere. Music transition improved, too, (I hope)

15.0: Going South
Lex and Teschmacher's deleted scene reinserted

16.0: Pink Bear
Tried EVERYTHING with the screen test and weighed out alternatives. Ultimately, ended up with this. Selutron's compromise didn't work for me- even though Lois agreed looks far better there.

17.0: Attacking Paris/Rushmore
Post-preview, I've trimmed these down.. thanx to Verisimlitude and Joe.

18.0: Press Conference
Too new footage to match? Yeah......but storywise, works for me, better than without, imo.

19.0:First FOS
Lois/Supes to FOS....I think I used the theatrical, more Thorne, the better

20.0: Composite Smalltown
Mixed/matched Villains attacking the smalltown as if it were already in the middle of an ongoing random attack around the world. Post-preview, redid some of the weaker fire fx

21.0: Superman flowers
The uhms/ahs didn't bother me to delete--- though I am curious with their removal.

22.0: Zod's speech
Got lazy. Rather than do a bit with Zod atop of the Washington Monument and destroying the Monument before a crowd, I inserted Zod's words over the army prepping body bags of (presumably) the villains' victims.

23.0: Superman gets Lois drunk
Coulda done the souffle scene with flame composites, but it didn't add enough for me- visually, the champaigne scene looked nicer shot to me.
Agreed that "I'm going to change into something more comfortable" is a cringe-worthy line, but its deletion would be more distracting to me.

24.0: Washington Monument attack
Borrowed bits...and did a lazy transition, eventually maybe I'll have Non kick more arse in composites down the line.

25.0: Depowering in a white gown
Tried pasting Supergirl's shirt onto Lois.....but it was just horrible. Horrible.
Flipped the concept and composited/edited gown Lois into the scene, borrowing some ideas from Verisimilitude and RKS. Tough tough scene to edit, I don't quite think it's totally right, even now. I imagined that the 'Superman in flames' was always in Clark's head--- and since I'm stuck with the shot of the lingering Superman in the theatrical, at least there's a precedence of the idea of it being in Supes' mind if I keep it in.

26.0: So you are a general
Borrowed bit, ya know...

27.0: Superbed
Transition

28.0: Monument falls
RDC shot/matched by the tv/cut to footage from another film telling the president and all the staff that they have to get out NOW!!!

29.0: White House Donner attack
Everything the same....except, added the Thorne music of attack on the DP--- About that.... I'm actually fine with repeated music as long as it's not tooooo much, but that's a judgement call of what's too much. (Sometimes it is sheer exhaustion, I confess). After some wrangling, suprised myself by cutting out the bit of Ursa winking at the guy who cringes in fear. My memory is that Ursa seemed more of a badass by her kicking him fast and hard in the theatrical choice. Otherwise, Donner all the way.

30.0: Diner
Here's the thing..... I still have a difficult time believing that the voice Lois uses in the RDC is hers, since it's SO different (in my opinion) and soft by comparison to her voice in the theatrical or IRC..... I may be TOTALLY wrong--- but over and over again- it didn't sound like her to me, so the theatrical Diner voices were chosen (although painful to switch Reeve's voice--- was an interesting different take in the RDC, and hard to mix as the music in the background has different timing)

31.0: Repowering
Discussed this before....whlle I HATE the fact that both were shot so differently- The best choice is 'what's less bad'? So, I thought converting bits of the Lester to Donner lighting less bad than darkening the Donner.... although I totally get how darkening all and switching at different points could help.

Also, a shorter recap during the repowering (You will see my life thru your eyes/etc.) is definitely not a bad idea.....but time consuming figuring out the details. For a later time, I think. I agree with Tyler that Reeve on the ground in silence works better, will have to revisit later on...

32.0: Luthor at White House
Mainly rotocomposited "Praying...yes, to me" although grainy, to fit semi-letterbox. Speaking of changing letterbox ratio aspects....guilty on all fronts, due to fx footage being different aspect ratios, etc.-

33.0: Daily Planet Attack
Reinserted "Doorknobs". I agree with TylerDurden that the emotion of the Lester Lois is really nice (that she doubts he'll be back)- Lois looks SO terrible (and Jimmy looks so different) in that wig, that I've limited those shots to inserts from a distance.

34.0: Metropolis Battle
The kitchen sink, weighing in a lot on pulling back later on.

35.0: Back to the Daily Planet
Reinserted the Lester choice of the villains' landing (donner shot)- and while it's all Donner footage, hated some of the angles Thau chose, so theres' a mix/match here.

About reinserting Lester choice: "Let us take one of them"- great idea, but: Lois looks SO terrible in that wig, I was taken out of the movie experience each and every time I see her in a close shot of her in it.

36.0: Transition
Reinsert the deleted arrival of the Villains to the front of the fortress.

37.0: Exploding force fields
Added a bit to help the transition of the 'forcefields' all collapsing around the Fortress, and a pissed off Reeve as he hears the villains coming for him.

38.0: Fortress Confrontation
Mostly Donner, but, again, Thau chose some really weaker alternatives, so I've readjusted and realigned it so that hopefully best of both are here.

Composited the IRC shot of Superman being thrown to the ground. Two seconds, but liked it a lot.

39.0: Arctic Police
Reinserted. Funny thing is, "Smallville Strongboy" line didn't bother me, because I always assumed that just as there are landmarks in America that are used as reference... (i.e. Rhode Island as the smallest state in the union, Hollywood as the place for movies, etc.)--- I took Lex's phrase of "Smallville Strongboy" not necessarily having to be Lex's knowledge of Superman's origins, but Smallville the town as being a popular reference in that universe.

40.0: Destroying FOS/Lois/Supes talk
Again.... I could be totally wrong- but the Kidder voice is so soft outside the Fortress of Solitude that its distracting to me...that I felt compelled to bring back the IRC line readings for the talk and the balcony scene. and the IRC had such a nice music mix, that I tried to reintegrate this as much as possible--- with a lot of painful difficulty, as the IRC is so grainy by comparison. Same with the balcony scene after. Extremely subjective, I know.

41.0: Next Day at the DP
Trimmed that sucker severely. Lois looks terrible, the writing of much of it is redundant to the arctic scenes, directed terribly......so I truncated it so that (hopefully) it looks like much is unspoken, but still comprehensive. Transition to Verisimlitudes' excellent 'memory loss pov' sequence.

42.0: Transition shots of time passing..
Thought it good to be vague.... how much time has passed for the memory wipe? How much damage is done to her brain? Being an 'instant fix' always looked like a bad sitcom... making it a bit murky feels better to me.

43.0: Concorde scene/new day/Lois wakes up
A fresh new day- For both Supes and Lois.... found footage of Kidder around that time frame.

44.0: Pizza w/Clark
Donner scene

45.0: Jimmy's New Camera
Reinserted deleted scene....with music sequeway to

46.0: Lester Alleyway change
Fortunately, Clark has the same suit as the prior scene-

47.0: Perry's wondering what's going on
Placed here.... just like the idea of something just happened, although he's not sure what. Why is his office in one piece? Suggests again that time has passed in a murky fashion and Superman could have easily have helped fix it (if need be).

48.0: Diner scene
Lester chosen sound fx. Why? Familiarity, plus I think the over the top sound fx is appropriate here. Subjective choice, I know.

49.0: Returning the flag
Got lazy. Frozen fountains. Blame the villains and Lester.

50.0: Flyby
STM- same thing, and brighter--- composited with STM ending credit/Superman III coming/

51.0: Ending
Comic book is closed. Curtains close. Audience applause (despite some sloppy editing, they're still applauding. Go figure) ;p

[Jimbo]

Sept 11, 2009 13:12:40 GMT -5 crazy_asian_man said:

0.2: Dedication to Unsworth;
Why not Reeve? It's supposed to simulate the experience (sorta) of what it might have been like, had plans gone according to plan in 1978/1980.

Actually, if the film had gone on as intended, there wouldn't have been a dedication to Unsworth as STM already got one.

I do think there would have been a dedication to John Barry, however. He was the production designer of STM and the Donner portions of S2, and died in 1979.

[crazy_asian_man]

Actually, if the film had gone on as intended, there wouldn't have been a dedication to Unsworth as STM already got one.

I do think there would have been a dedication to John Barry, however. He was the production designer of STM and the Donner portions of S2, and died in 1979.

Excellent point! I actually put "December 1978" over the pre-credits as the initial plan (I'm pretty sure) was to release them SIMULTANEOUSLY (or at least pretty close), so that one could go see STM at one theatre, and run to see SII across the street at another.

I'm not sure if what I'd heard was rumor at the time (after all 3 Musketeers and 4 Musketeers didn't come out at the same time), but when thinking about it, would have been a cool 'first' in the cinemas, as far as I know, to have been able to do that.

But then again, Supes II has the distinction of being a fountain of 'if only' thoughts..... ;p

[TylerDurden389]

About your thoughts of things being distracting if certain bits are not there, I actually feel the opposite. My main reason for getting into this whole Superman 2 movement 6 years ago is so that I can FORGET all those moments, and I must say, after watching so many fan cuts, it's beginning to work.

When I watch a fan edit or any version of Superman 2 for that matter, the Lester bits that don't work (IMO) are beginning to stand out (since I don't see them in any of the other cuts). So CAM, for you the "orange juice" bits not being there for you is a distraction, for me the bits being there is a distraction lol.

Basically I want those scenes completely wiped from my memory. My best example for this would be when I watched another Superman fan edit called "Superman Redeemed", which is basically parts 3 and 4 combined into one movie. Because I hadn't seen either of those movies in their entirety since I was a little kid, I was able to watch it with an (almost) fresh perspective. And I actually enjoyed it because of that.