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Post by Olly H 82 on Dec 30, 2011 7:45:15 GMT -5
My latest review, i hope you gents enjoy it. Im sure there will be some debating about my comments! ;D
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atp
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Post by atp on Dec 31, 2011 4:03:16 GMT -5
Very good review.
I never realised Ethan also played that fool Ellis in Die Hard.
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Post by Olly H 82 on Dec 31, 2011 6:14:55 GMT -5
Cheers Nick!. Hope you have a good new years mate!
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Jan 2, 2012 16:31:49 GMT -5
Interesting review, thanks for sharing it! In reading the script w/Superman in it, it reads better (no camp) and makes MUCH more sense than the theatrical.... but even then, the script leaves a lot to be desired. For sure, it would have been better with Superman in it (even if they had to recast the role) as it really makes even less sense without him in it. I wonder if Reeve backed out at the last minute based on how he was treated on Superman III. Having half of that film devoted to Richard Pryor didn't make Reeve happy..... after that, I wonder if any good will with the Salkinds/WB evaporated at that point, as the script for Supergirl also puts Superman in a supporting role?  |
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Post by Tristan D on Jan 28, 2012 19:12:41 GMT -5
CAM: Do you know where I could find that script? I've only ever seen the versions of the script without him in.
Very good review Olly, thank you!
I really enjoy the fantasy tone of the film, and it seems very much a product of the 80s. There are also some elements of the film that reference really seminal fantasy literature. Supergirl's story is very much like the Wizard of Oz or Alice in Wonderland, and Selena's story is very much like the Portrait of Dorian Gray (which was much more pronounced in earlier scripts). Also, noticed the other day the parallels between the 'Omegahedron' and 'Power of Shadow' and HP Lovecraft's 'Shining Trapezohedron' and ' Nyarlathotep' in The Haunter of the Dark.
The special effects are on the whole pretty good, and the flying is of a much better quality than the original Superman films. That said, there are a number of points where the effects seem very lackluster and cheap e.g. Supergirl being 'stretched' by the Shadow or the general poor quality of the jump cuts. It's a shame, because I think the film unfairly gets a reputation for poor effects, because amid all the fantastic flying and model work, you get things like the horribly animated tornado at the end.
Personally, I'm not sure whether Superman would have helped the film, or just proven a distraction and a more pointed reminded that this was a spin off. In any case, it would have helped to explain her getting settled into Earth life.
Ultimately a semi-decent film which remains probably the best attempt at delivering a female-led superhero film, but one that falls short of its potential.
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Post by Tristan D on Jan 28, 2012 19:21:11 GMT -5
I wonder if Reeve backed out at the last minute based on how he was treated on Superman III. Having half of that film devoted to Richard Pryor didn't make Reeve happy..... after that, I wonder if any good will with the Salkinds/WB evaporated at that point, as the script for Supergirl also puts Superman in a supporting role? It's hard to tell. The Salkinds decided to film Supergirl partly because Reeve had already ruled out making more Superman Films. That said, why would he agree to cameo in the first place if he had made his mind up to back away from the role. |
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Post by Olly H 82 on Jan 29, 2012 8:39:45 GMT -5
hey Tristan cheers for the feedback. I agree with you about the stretched image of supergirl at the end. They were a bit too ambitious with that effect. You can find my other reviews here www.blip.tv/oliverharper |
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ye5man
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Post by ye5man on Jan 29, 2012 11:59:07 GMT -5
Probably an easy pay check without carrying the movie Perhaps when he learned how big the role the Salkinds really had in mind, he walked  |
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Jan 29, 2012 12:18:23 GMT -5
I bought it at a comic/scifi convention years ago from a vendor, pre-internet. If I can find it, I'll scan the parts with Superman.
I also did a search and saw only the post-Superman versions of the script, too.
Going off of memory, Superman is contacted early on in the film- and HE retrieves the bubble with his cousin in it.
Afterwards, as Clark Kent, he sets her up with the school---
Then- something happens (I forget what exactly) in which Superman gets sick by the villain's doings--- and then is out of the picture for the majority of it while Supergirl hunts down the baddie- and then saves him at the end when she defeats the villain.
It's a small part, maybe 5-8 pages at most, if memory serves right---
Maybe the producers talked him into it- comparing it to a Brando cameo- but, maybe that was before all the bad ill-will with Superman III (We know now that Reeve was pissed off at having half of the film be about Pryor by different sources- also, I remember one interview in the newspaper, where Reeve showed being more than a little irked at the cash-ins on the movie (the soundtrack which featured songs that were made to just sell the soundtrack, but were barely in the film in the first place- the reporter noted that his tone sounded a bit irritated with the producers in the article)....
In any case, we also know that Reeve hung out with Slater (Slater's interview) for a bit.... just to re-emphasize how close he must have been to being in the film with her.
Still...
There's a lot of nice production value in Supergirl--- just having the Superman character appear in the movie would have removed the lack of logic with Supergirl at the school. Might not have removed all the camp, but it would have been a more interesting film I would think.
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atp
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Post by atp on Jan 29, 2012 14:38:17 GMT -5
Which is better: Supergirl or Superman returns?
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Jan 29, 2012 21:20:50 GMT -5
Superman Returns. I don't think a movie about Supergirl returning and finding out that she had an unexpected child with Lois would work as well..... |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Jan 29, 2012 22:20:10 GMT -5
Not a bad question ATP. Its a little harder than I thought it'd be to answer but I'll say SR is better than Supergirl. Supergirl has the more consistently good special effects but even compared to Superman Returns the story is pretty thin and Dunaway is chewing scenery like Jaws chews swimmers.
They both have pretty good scores
I actually like Slater a little bit better than Routh.
I know SIII SIV Supergirl and SR don't fit together at all but it would be interesting if all 4 could be counted in the same continuity. Supermans absence in pre SR could be the explanation for his absence in Supergirl.
Of course this would all require some re editing since SIII and SIV contradict SR in a lot of ways and vice versa. Martha Kent is dead in SIII but alive in SR and The kid is no where in sight in SIV
I'm not even sure how the timeline could work out.
With some re editing
STM SII SIII SG SIV SR?
STM SII SG SR SIII SIV?
or
STM SII SIII SG SR SIV
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monkeymagic
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Post by monkeymagic on Jan 30, 2012 4:48:01 GMT -5
I've said this before and I'll say it again. I always thought that the reason for Superman's abscene is as he was off looking for Argo City. It was the bit where the radio talks about Superman going off to look for life forms outside of Earth.
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ye5man
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Post by ye5man on Jan 30, 2012 6:19:41 GMT -5
Good idea
To answer ATP, SR is the best of the two for me.
The real question is which one is less heavy-handed/dreary?
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Post by Tristan D on Jan 30, 2012 17:00:55 GMT -5
I think the characters' motivations could have been developed a bit more. Selena's generic evilness could have been a better exploration of avarice and materialism (since her world domination seems more about getting better diggs and pimping her ride than anything more political). Similarly, there's nothing to really explore why Supergirl behaves in a virtuous manner (beyond the supposition that everyone from Krypton / Argo is raised perfectly). Also - everyone from Krypton (Jor-El, Lara, Zod, Ursa, Zaltar, Alura etc.) speaks with an English accent. Except Kara for some reason . . I do really enjoy the action sequences though. Good idea To answer ATP, SR is the best of the two for me. The real question is which one is less heavy-handed/dreary? Superman Returns is a better film. But it is obviously more dreary than Supergirl, which is mostly quite light hearted. The biggest issue with including SR with SIII, SIV is that you have to assume that SIII and SIV happened while Lois was preggers - and in that case you have to assume that she didn't know she was preggers or that nobody wanted to mention it (I guess they were all a little awkward because she couldn't remember who the father was ). If you really want to consider them all cannon though, SG fits in nicely as a precursor to SR. I watched a marathon of the films when the Ultimate Box Set came out with STM, SII, SIII, SIV, SG, SR - that was a long day! |
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Post by Tristan D on Jan 30, 2012 17:02:50 GMT -5
I bought it at a comic/scifi convention years ago from a vendor, pre-internet. If I can find it, I'll scan the parts with Superman. The whole thing would be a welcome treat to be honest, if you're up to it  |
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Jan 30, 2012 19:08:13 GMT -5
Citizen Kane, Gone with the Wind, Ghandi, Lawrence of Arabia, and The Godfather parts one and two were more heavy handed/dreary than Superman Returns. |
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Jan 30, 2012 19:10:16 GMT -5
I'm currently in a looooong process of cleaning up all my movie memorabilia..... 5-8 pages is no problem, once I come across it. Unfortunately, I'd be too lazy to scan the WHOLE script. (There is a lot of similiarity to what came out, but minus the camp and Supes for the final theatrical vs. the script).
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Jan 30, 2012 19:16:59 GMT -5
Interesting thought-
With some tweaks,
I think
STM SII SIII SIV SG SR?
If after SIV it's suggested that survivors of Krypton existed (interesting if Argo City's existence adds to Lex's faking of the news)--- then SG plays into the absence, and SR has his return.
Definitely something to ponder....
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2012 15:16:11 GMT -5
Gus Gorman is the father. You read it here first.
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Feb 2, 2012 16:20:00 GMT -5
Gus Gorman is the father. You read it here first. This sounds like a job for Donahue  |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Feb 2, 2012 21:16:21 GMT -5
I never commented on the actual review, Olly.
I pretty much agree with everything you said. Great point about Super girls front projection vs Rocketeers bluescreen. A lot of the flying fx in Supergirl still hold up while a lot of the work on Rocketeer looks flat/cut and paste. If Rocketeer had used front projection at the level of Supergirls it would be perfect.
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Post by Olly H 82 on Feb 3, 2012 6:40:37 GMT -5
Thanks Metallo much appreciated. Blue screen does suck when compared to front projection.
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Post by Jimbo on Feb 3, 2012 13:18:40 GMT -5
Mike from Cinemassacre.com (AVGN) also did a review of Supergirl. cinemassacre.com/2012/01/23/supergirl-1984/He brought attention to the rope pulling 'Supergirl' out of the water, but failed to notice it was a cardboard cutout. Ugh, he too said Christopher Reeves. Olly, your review was better, no mistakes. |
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Post by Olly H 82 on Feb 3, 2012 13:25:13 GMT -5
Cheers Jimbo, i did see his review. Its funny to a certain degree. The cardboard cut out scene the wire is only visible if you zoom in like he did. In cinemascope you cant see it. Mike is not as good as James Rolfe when it comes to reviews. Also he calls everything blue screen shots. Nope hardly any in Supergirl.
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