Adam's Superman Movie Observations

[Jor-L5150]

Dec 3, 2008 13:06:47 GMT -5 @adam15 said:

Cause I was expecting Superman to have jet black hair and a bright red cape and a brilliant yellow belt.
Instead I saw a Superman with brown hair and a brown cape and a piss-yellow belt.

Seriously, for a movie made by a bunch of Superman fanboys they shoulda at least got that part right. I mean Superman's suit is the color of poo.. Singer probably took Reeve's costume and ran it thru a sewer pipe.

[ReeveIsSuperman]

I didnt agree with the new look and bad hair superman either. Plus Routh reminded me of a dawson's creek character. But look, If you didnt like it, there's nothing you can do about it. Just let people enjoy it. You cant compare it to The Original. I just enjoy the Original Superman Movie (& II) all that much more. Maybe they will take routh's costume to the dry cleaners for the next one.

[Metallo]

. Didn't he get a pair from Betty?

But he didn't wear them which made it even worse...and because of that no matter how well written or directed or acted the movie was it still SUCKED, Shogun!

Iron Man sucked because it wasn't the 70's armor. Just an awful piece of crap.

[thepariah]

This thread amuses me. Continue. ;D

[Jor-L5150]

i could have used the suit being brighter- but i totally understand why they shook it up a bit ( a lot... ) .

in the seventies , " spandex " was a new material. it was exotic enough to look stunning in a movie. the previous superman had actually worn leotards, by the seveties that would have been looking too childish for donner's verisimilitude and the bright spandex worked beautifully ( as did the reflective krypton clothing ) . given the era of the films S:TM-S:III it works- it holds up in THAT context.

in the 2000's spandex is a joke. just try to get taken seriously in spandex. UNLESS you are a wickedly hot chick - or a bodybuilder you will look ridiculous and a movie where superman wears spandex will look low-budget. it would look like widescreen " lois and clark " . the HAD to come up with a material and look that WAS ALIEN since the suit comes from krypton. spandex has been forever ruined by fatasses and bicyclers. it looks silly.

the new costume had to be made of material that doesnt say : " you can buy this at walmart where you will see mouth-brethers wearing it."


as to the color- it too was done to make it more exotic than a 4-color comic strip. they may have gotten carried away with the tone of it, but it made story-sense.

[Jimbo]

Ya know what, he's right!!!!!!

Say what you want about the Borg Superman concept for Burton's aborted movie, but at least he had a BRIGHT RED CAPE! GREENLIGHT THAT BITCH!



Oops, I meant "abortion of a movie".

[Jor-L5150]

Dec 3, 2008 16:34:58 GMT -5 Jimbo said:

Ya know what, he's right!!!!!!

Say what you want about the Borg Superman concept for Burton's aborted movie, but at least he had a BRIGHT RED CAPE! GREENLIGHT THAT BITCH!



Oops, I meant "abortion of a movie".

SUPER-ZOMBIE!
a film by tim burton

[MAVERICK]

PWNED.

[adam15]

The sad thing is a lot of people had a bit of buyers remorse when they saw Superman Returns. Suddenly Superman Lives seemed a little more intriguing...

Well, anyway...


You guys remember how depressingly Evil Superman was in Superman III? He had the same colors as the standard Superman Returns suit. Remeber how awesome it was to see Clark ripping open his shirt at the junkyard with the True Red and Yellow S shield?

[stargazer01]

YAAAAAAAAWN.

Sorry, but this is soo two years ago; there is no drama anymore.


But, I wanted to comment on this:

"You guys remember how depressingly Evil Superman was in Superman III? He had the same colors as the standard Superman Returns suit."

Not to me. Evil Superman was HOT.

[adam15]

OUT OF DATE??? I mean talking about ANYTHING in the Reeve movies is dated by that logic!

[MAVERICK]

No, she means the tired SR trolling.

[Metallo]

The sad thing is a lot of people had a bit of buyers remorse when they saw Superman Returns. Suddenly Superman Lives seemed a little more intriguing...

You've gotta be kidding.

Anyway...Spider-man 2 sucked because Doc Ock wasn't sporting his green overalls and the mustard yellow belt, gloves and boots.





THE biggest crime since the OJ' cases not guilty verdict!

[Jimbo]

I still can't get over not having yellow spandex in X-Men.

And Batman never has pure white eyes in the movies. Excuse me....pupils? Are you kidding me? Freaking hacks.

[Metallo]

Batman never wore fucking rubber. Where's the blue and grey underwear?? Looks like a big rubber turd. That makes Dark Knight ASS!.

[Jimbo]

Dean Cain's Superman outfit was total ASS!

....oh wait, I guess there's no argument there. ;D

[Matt in the Hat]

Fact of the matter is, Superman hasn't went through that big of a change in costume, so the minor stuff sticks out more. If you switch from a brown and grey wool costume to a bright blue and red spandex one, it really sticks out. Sure the form doesn't change much, but shit's still noticeable. If you want to compare and contrast how different it is, put up a pic between Dean Cain and Brandon Routh. Why Cain? Because he was the last guy to have a go in the suit. You can see right away there are many differences in materials, color, etc. even though it's essentially supposed to be "the same thing". On the note of spandex being for "bodybuilders", you can notice that in between them, regardless of body shape, they're both physically fit. Sure Cain had more muscle mass and Routh was taller. I don't think it matters much. It's not as if Routh has love handles or anything either. So Routh could pull off tights. And the costume should always look handmade and not manufactured. Cause his mom made it, and he loves his mommy! Aww.

[Jor-L5150]

Dec 3, 2008 18:15:02 GMT -5 @adam15 said:

You guys remember how depressingly Evil Superman was in Superman III? He had the same colors as the standard Superman Returns suit. Remeber how awesome it was to see Clark ripping open his shirt at the junkyard with the True Red and Yellow S shield?

this is not a jab at you- it just reminds me of a tired debate.

but S:III / SR costume similarities is a classic example of apples and oranges.

S:III - superman's red/yellow/blue suit becomes purple/violet/dingy yellow for TWO reasons , overt and subtextual :
1) - literal : superman's suit needs washed. his boy scout image is is eroding and his boy scout image is eschewed for a bad boy image that doesnt suit him, and eventually he realises this.... which takes us to....
2) - subtext : red and blue make purple. supermans superman suit is made of sharp primary colors in sharp contast. in SIII , the blurring of the colors from red and blue to violet is symbolic of superman's moral compass wavering. whearas he had graciously resisted miss tesmaucher , he loses his mind for lorelie. he inflicts needless violence for the heck of it - when he defeats this aspect of himself his moral clarity - and his visual appearance ( a visual dogma ) is restored.

SUPERMAN RETURNS -

completely different. the suit is not erratically changed to convey a change of personality- it is done for aesthetics . like i posted a few posts ago- it was created to look exotic and alien. the kryptonians superficially look human , but thier culture(s) , fashion , technology are completely different from our sensibilities . like john byrne at dc comics in the 80's , the effort to establish superman as not-human-but-desiring-humanity leads to cosmetic changes . we are rightly surprised by some of these - but it is unfair to say S3 and SR costumes are synonimous .

we have to accept a natural evolution here, if brandon routh was wearing kirk alyn's leotards we would have laughed our way out of the damn movie theater . superman is alien. mythically he is a god-man. so his indigenous costume material HAS to NOT resmble something we could easily identify.

[Jor-L5150]

Dec 3, 2008 20:29:52 GMT -5 Matt in the Hat said:

. It's not as if Routh has love handles or anything either. So Routh could pull off tights. And the costume should always look handmade and not manufactured. Cause his mom made it, and he loves his mommy! Aww.

if we are going with a byrne superman-to-death of superman version then , yes. the costume is pa kent's idea and home made. this however is a peculiar version ( one that i actually quite like- i have met byrne and he is cool ) .

but SUPERMAN RETURNS is a .... sorta... kinda... donnerverse superman . in that regard, it follows the rules of donnerverse, and the silver-age/neo-silver-age superman- which posits that the suit material is made on krypton out of kryptonian technology and sensibilties. it therefore CANNOT look " homemade " .

there is nothing wrong with byrne's denomination , but it is not the doctrine that bryan singer appealed to.

[thepariah]

Dec 3, 2008 20:29:52 GMT -5 Matt in the Hat said:

On the note of spandex being for "bodybuilders", you can notice that in between them, regardless of body shape, they're both physically fit. Sure Cain had more muscle mass and Routh was taller. I don't think it matters much. It's not as if Routh has love handles or anything either.

I beg to differ a little...that rubber belt seemed so tight sometimes he DID almost sport a wee pair of handles. I would joke that 5 years in stasis made him a bit flabby. ;D

Dec 3, 2008 20:29:52 GMT -5 Matt in the Hat said:

And the costume should always look handmade and not manufactured. Cause his mom made it, and he loves his mommy! Aww.

She even embroidered "CLARK" on the inside of his trunks. Of course, no one's even going to dream of giving him a wedgie...

[crazy_asian_man]

SUPERMAN RETURNS -

completely different. the suit is not erratically changed to convey a change of personality- it is done for aesthetics . like i posted a few posts ago- it was created to look exotic and alien. the kryptonians superficially look human , but thier culture(s) , fashion , technology are completely different from our sensibilities . like john byrne at dc comics in the 80's , the effort to establish superman as not-human-but-desiring-humanity leads to cosmetic changes . we are rightly surprised by some of these - but it is unfair to say S3 and SR costumes are synonimous .

we have to accept a natural evolution here, if brandon routh was wearing kirk alyn's leotards we would have laughed our way out of the damn movie theater . superman is alien. mythically he is a god-man. so his indigenous costume material HAS to NOT resmble something we could easily identify.

Even though I wasn't totally crazy about the changes myself- well said!

And... it was close enough imo-- ESPECIALLY when you see the 'alternate' costumes we would have gotten with Burton, etc.--- but, again, everyone's entitled to like/dislike what they want, and to what degree.

Still...I wonder if Batman fans are as bothered with the costume changes in the Nolan movies- ?

[fggafagas]

The colors are only one problem with his overall look. He just doesn't look powerful. He looks skinny, very skinny, and what muscle definition you can see through the suit looks like padding.

[Jor-L5150]

Dec 3, 2008 21:58:32 GMT -5 crazy_asian_man said:

SUPERMAN RETURNS -

completely different. the suit is not erratically changed to convey a change of personality- it is done for aesthetics . like i posted a few posts ago- it was created to look exotic and alien. the kryptonians superficially look human , but thier culture(s) , fashion , technology are completely different from our sensibilities . like john byrne at dc comics in the 80's , the effort to establish superman as not-human-but-desiring-humanity leads to cosmetic changes . we are rightly surprised by some of these - but it is unfair to say S3 and SR costumes are synonimous .

we have to accept a natural evolution here, if brandon routh was wearing kirk alyn's leotards we would have laughed our way out of the damn movie theater . superman is alien. mythically he is a god-man. so his indigenous costume material HAS to NOT resmble something we could easily identify.

Even though I wasn't totally crazy about the changes myself- well said!

And... it was close enough imo-- ESPECIALLY when you see the 'alternate' costumes we would have gotten with Burton, etc.--- but, again, everyone's entitled to like/dislike what they want, and to what degree.

Still...I wonder if Batman fans are as bothered with the costume changes in the Nolan movies- ?

it would be like saying a mormon and a catholic are both " christian " and therefore a mormon should honor a catholic custom while a catholic honored a mormon doctrine.

these are competing versions , and while there is a common root- there are mutually exclusive elements that put a clear line of demarcation between them. in this case , the alien nature of superman - in donnerverse - demands that the production use whatever they can to display that supermans suit be as alien as posssible.
in the 70's spandex was wierd enough . in 20 years who knows what we'll be seeing in superhero holo-films.

[ReeveIsSuperman]

Dec 3, 2008 22:19:43 GMT -5 @fggafagas said:

The colors are only one problem with his overall look. He just doesn't look powerful. He looks skinny, very skinny, and what muscle definition you can see through the suit looks like padding.

I would say the 'S' design is also a bad idea. The Reeve 'S' looked perfect and need not be altered. The Routh 'S' just makes you think that some kindergardeners had a contest to re-design it. I keep thinking of toys-r-us everytime I look at the SR costume. There's this plastic quality to it. But ultimately I understand, that They were going for a Departure from The Reeve (perfect) Look to help Routh have his own identity as superman. It was just too much of a departure for me. I hate the mini-boots too.

[ye5man]

I think Adam is winding you all guys, lol