Kirok
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"You have failed this city!"
Posts: 3,179
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Post by Kirok on Jan 14, 2009 19:04:49 GMT -5
I like both Welling and Routh; there's no reason they can't coexist. It's unfortunate so much of fandom is split on them though, but it's understandable. Welling fans feel as if Routh took a role that was rightfully Welling's, and continue to feel discriminated against to this day with WB's film division imposing so many restrictions on the series as to not 'interfere' with the movies. Along the same line, they see Routh and the film franchise as a roadblock to Welling becoming Superman, the logical pay off of the series' eight year journey. On the other hand, Routh fans have had Welling fans on their case since Routh's casting was announced, and feel threatened by the very existence of Welling and "Smallville." This has only increased as time has gone on and there has been little to no development on a SR sequel.
Things would be a lot better if WB wasn't so weird about it's film/television relations. Sure they say the films and the series are "separate but equal" to borrow a phrase, but they allow one to impose unfair restrictions on the other. Personally I feel jipped that "Smallville" was around long before SR came along, and is still going strong three years after the film came and went, yet still must concern itself with the movies. Especially considering how aimless the film division seems to be with Superman and all of its DC characters besides Batman.
I've said it before and I'll say it again; if WB goes forward with a new Supeman project that doesn't involve either Welling OR Routh, then they will feel the wrath of the fanboys who will unite and rise up in protest against whatever poor soul becomes the next Man of Steel.
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Jan 14, 2009 22:53:45 GMT -5
Even after all this time, it's still hard for me to understand how SR could generate such ill-will among some fans. It's as if SR-haters would have preferred the franchise staying in limbo for another ten years (or more) than have SR exist.
I'm glad that at least there was enough box office to show it was NOT a failure and had an audience that saw it more than once. It didn't meet WB's box-office expectations, sure, but it was not "Catwoman". I mean, really... the alternative was going to be McG's (or was it Ratner)'s revisionist version of Supes with the Abrams' script, with a Krypton that wasn't destroyed.
*sigh*
Sadly, if WB puts in limbo for another ten years, I doubt anyone wins out.
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Post by adam15 on Jan 15, 2009 16:10:07 GMT -5
Your argument is deeply flawed. NO, not everyone in the whole freaking world was eagerly anticipating another Superman movie as you say. FACT. If they were, the opening weekend would have broken records at the BO. The rest of your argument is pure opinion and speculation based on your ridiculous hate for all things SR. The anticipation for SR outweighed BB dude.... SR made more opening weeked by about 5 mil. And that great anticipation was what made SR eek past BB in total gross. NOW..................... I have a question for U! Why is there an ugly CGI close up of SUperman flying @ the end of SR? I can understand long shots, but why that ugly ass CGI close up of Routh. I thought Lucas was bad........... this really takes it. We get a CGI brown cape-man !!! da-da-da-dah! (I dance around my room like gus gorman ripping off Routh's cape that Lois prolly used as Jason's super diaper while he was gone which explains it's color.......) |
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Metallo
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The worlds finest heroes
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Post by Metallo on Jan 16, 2009 11:09:20 GMT -5
Stargazers a girl I think, "dude." And you're wrong. Show me some hard numbers to back up what your saying beyond your own opinion. WB may have had big expectations as did some fans but otherwise i didn't see much different than any other big movie.
Its those people who are upset that they didn't get exactly what they wanted. The same people that cry for every franchise these days to be rebooted instead of doing what SMART creators like Meyer and Bennett did for Star Trek II.
Its those same kind of people that are shoving remake after remake down our throats.
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Post by EnriqueH on Jan 16, 2009 11:59:13 GMT -5
I love Superman III. It is a bit of a guilty pleasure though and it's a tough viewing if you're watching it immediately after STM and SII. But despite its flaws, I really enjoy it. And given the script, it's a better movie than it has a right to be.
As a kid, I enjoyed Richard Pryor in the role. I also loved that final scene between him and Reeve. The look on Pryor's face when he looked at Superman with admiration is, I think, the way we all looked at Reeve as Superman.
As I always said, it's a bad idea executed well.
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Post by adam15 on Jan 16, 2009 12:35:15 GMT -5
Stargazers a girl I think, "dude." And you're wrong. Show me some hard numbers to back up what your saying beyond your own opinion. WB may have had big expectations as did some fans but otherwise i didn't see much different than any other big movie. |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Jan 16, 2009 13:30:59 GMT -5
How does 4 million extra dollars show a HUGE gap in anticipation? have you ever stopped to think that SR may have opened on a few more screens? Show me some articles or data that gives the opinion of the entire movie going public or people across the country. You're pulling this "HUGE" anticipation thing out of somewhere and its not from the official record thats for sure  |
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Post by adam15 on Jan 16, 2009 13:58:34 GMT -5
ayyyyyy.... Superman Returns had a greater level anticipation than Batman Begins. That's why it was realeased on more screens, that was why it made more $$ opening weekend and that was why it make a larger total gross. If you are trying to agrue that SR actually made LESS than BB per screen then you'll get some credit in the the anticipation argument , but you'll lose ground on the notion that, all things considered, SR WAS a flop.
It flopped like superman's little bitty impotent lifless willie that he tries in vain to stimulate while he's stalking Lois!
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Metallo
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The worlds finest heroes
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Post by Metallo on Jan 16, 2009 14:51:48 GMT -5
Maybe WB GOT it on more screens. How does that translate into the PUBLICS anticipation? And we're still talking about just 4 million dollars. Wheres the gap? SHOW me the hard data you've collected from the movie going public. Did ya go door to door doing surveys? Your argument is built on SAND, dude. Maybe if you want flying pink elephants to be real they will be but I doubt it. Its sad that the BEST you can do is sit here and waste your time over and over bitching about a movie thats been out for years. You don't like it go make your own movie and wait for the billions to role in. And PUNISHER WARZONE was a flop. At best SR didn't live up to expectations. You need to learn what flop means AFTER you accept reality |
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Post by Jimbo on Jan 16, 2009 14:55:35 GMT -5
Comparing opening weekends, SR earned more per screen than BB did.
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Jan 16, 2009 14:56:18 GMT -5
Another dose of reality. And I'm STILL waiting on the survey he did of every person in America and then the rest of the world.
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Post by adam15 on Jan 16, 2009 15:34:21 GMT -5
Hey Metallo you sound like a swell fellow. I'd high five ya if I could! Now I'm going to take the time to explain something that is actually quite simple. Superman Returns was released on more screens than Batman Begins. Superman Returns made more money per screen than Batman Begins. Superman Returns was released in IMAX 3d, Batman Begins wasn't. Superman Returns had an online video blog wherin fans could track the progress of the film development. It was also a big story that Singer was goin to helm SR. Therefore it is logical to assume that there was more anticipation behind SR. I know anticipation is hard to quantify but this data should suffice. now, HIGH FIVE!!
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Jan 16, 2009 15:35:53 GMT -5
And all that means shit. You STILL haven't answered the question. |
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Post by adam15 on Jan 16, 2009 15:43:11 GMT -5
hahahahahaha people have been anticipating Superman Returns cause it took 10 years to finally be released ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D oh and by the way why do u think any movie makes more $$ opening weekend than another? Because one had more people who wanted 2 see it====== MORE ANTICIPATION!!!  |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Jan 16, 2009 16:14:00 GMT -5
again, you still haven't answered the question. if the movie was THAT much more anticipated more people would have gone to see it. Theres a 4 million dollar difference...thats it. Where's the survey? the hard data? You've confused corporate interest with the anticipation of the people. I feel sorry that you can't see the truth.  |
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Post by adam15 on Jan 16, 2009 17:45:32 GMT -5
there is a positive correlation between a opening weekend box office performance and the anticipation for the film. Tell me Metallo, why did more people see SR than BB on opening weekend? SR grossed 8% more than BB did opening weekend..... maybe folks were anticipating SR just a teeeny bit more yes??
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Jan 16, 2009 18:04:12 GMT -5
You make it out like its a huge difference. It wasn't. And you make it out like it was everyone. it wasn't. Your whole argument hinges on you blowing it out of proportion but now that you've been proven wrong you're trying to dial it down to save any face you can by saying even a "TEENY BIT" counts. Classic example of making a mountain out of a mole hill. Typical. fact is the movie didn't flop and there wasn't this HUGE anticipation that wasn't met. |
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Post by adam15 on Jan 16, 2009 18:25:13 GMT -5
yes the film flopped cause it barely made it's money back. I don't care how much money it made at the box office. IT WAS A FLOP cause it's revenue didn't exceed it's cost in an acceptable margin. Would WB have financed SR again knowing the money it would make??? heck no!
NOW..... it's safe to say a lot of people saw Superman Returns... 52 million bucks on opening weekend pretty much means that 2% or 1 in 50 people in the whole freakin country (USA) saw this movie during those two days assuming a ticket is 10 bucks. That constitutes "everyone" I didn't literally mean every single person in the counrty including your grandma was anticipating this film. I meant the general film going audience. Superman Returns made lots of money cause a Superman film hadn't been released since the 80's, plus all the Superman Lives drama of the 90's culminated with Bryan Singer leaving his outstanding X men franchise to bring this baby to the screen. It was a flop of course the film was doomed from the get go and there was no way it could make get that much past it's 250 mil cost.
BTW, didn't Singer stop doing those video blogs near the end cause he knew it was gona suck?? And didn't he admit he liked to go to drugs and sex parties which may have taken it's toll on the production?? And why was so much of the film cut? It's like they were trying to salvage this film last minute by making cuts ala SIV!!
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Post by Ollie W on Jan 16, 2009 21:29:28 GMT -5
Fact is if SR was a success then a sequel would've been hitting the screens this year.
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Post by stargazer01 on Jan 16, 2009 22:37:32 GMT -5
Fact is if SR was a success then a sequel would've been hitting the screens this year. There was going to be a sequel. It is was going to go forward, only a year later due to Singer's Valkyrie. I know this first hand; my boss is a producer at WB. He told me so himself last year. But the huge success of TDK changed everything. WB are blinded right now by it, hence the "darker Superman" comment that Robinov talked about. They are clueless. It's a miracle SR was made, actually, and that it was a great film. |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Jan 17, 2009 17:14:14 GMT -5
So you've got the budget (which we STILL don't know exactly how it breaks down). Lets say the movie did cost 300 million. With worldwide gross, merchandising, dvd's etc. I'm pretty sure the movie made a profit. keep in mind WB spent 50 million before Singer even stepped on board. Unless you've got ALL the data you've got no clue what the profit margin was exactly. Go ahead and give us ALL the info, expert explain to me how that anticipation is anything MORE than any other film? tons of films make that or MORE on opening weekend. This whole time you've been saying it was more anticipated. You're own post says this movie was average in terms of anticipation. There's been a huge comic book movie boom and its taken WB TEN TO FIFTEEN years of working on DC comics movies that still aren't out. Just because WB is incompetent and indecisive doesn't mean SR wasn't a success. The reason we don't have a SR sequel is the same reason we don't have virtually ANY DC comics films. They don't know what they're doing. there's Batman and thats it. Watchmen but thats taken almost 15 years to finish. |
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Post by Jor-L5150 on Jan 17, 2009 18:00:29 GMT -5
Fact is if SR was a success then a sequel would've been hitting the screens this year. There was going to be a sequel. It is was going to go forward, only a year later due to Singer's Valkyrie. I know this first hand; my boss is a producer at WB. He told me so himself last year. But the huge success of TDK changed everything. WB are blinded right now by it, hence the "darker Superman" comment that Robinov talked about. They are clueless. It's a miracle SR was made, actually, and that it was a great film. now now now my dear, we cant just unload something like that without a liiiiittle more ..eh ? stop teasing!!!  and yeah- its a miracle that : -tim burton was pulled 2weeks before shooting - mcg is afraid of flying and didnt want to go to australia - rattner and singer traded franchise commitments - jon peters was effectively restrained from any substatnial influence ( what took so long ? ) - the salkinds unloaded the archives for the RDC and brando in SR that was all serendipitous. i said it before in this or some other thread : every good/great superhero movie is a confluence of happy accidents- with a director who " gets it " being the most important ingrediant. if its good- they did it on accident. when they "PLAN" stuff its always awful. |
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Post by stargazer01 on Jan 17, 2009 20:57:44 GMT -5
There was going to be a sequel. It is was going to go forward, only a year later due to Singer's Valkyrie. I know this first hand; my boss is a producer at WB. He told me so himself last year. But the huge success of TDK changed everything. WB are blinded right now by it, hence the "darker Superman" comment that Robinov talked about. They are clueless. It's a miracle SR was made, actually, and that it was a great film. now now now my dear, we cant just unload something like that without a liiiiittle more ..eh ?  haha! but yeah, I'm telling the truth, though I totally understand if noone believes it. This is the Internet, after all, and you guys don't even know me. And I don't know a lot, really, but maybe a little more than most here. |
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Post by Jor-L5150 on Jan 17, 2009 23:10:39 GMT -5
now now now my dear, we cant just unload something like that without a liiiiittle more ..eh ? haha! but yeah, I'm telling the truth, though I totally understand if noone believes it. This is the Internet, after all, and you guys don't even know me. And I don't know a lot, really, but maybe a little more than most here. ( ahem...) ..ok, ...go on...... ( pm if you must ) |
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Post by erikhh on Jan 21, 2009 7:23:59 GMT -5
Hey guys If you happen to live near London or just in the UK, there is another chance to see Bryan Singer's 2006 blockbuster, with 20 minutes of footage in IMAX 3D. My younger brother and I went to see it with two friends in the summer of 2006, the four of us traveled from Denmark to the UK to see the movie  Fan or no fan?? hehe.... But it was all worth it, what an awesome experience. HUGE screen and biiiig sound, if you live nearby be sure to see it. It's worth your time, trust me. Url for date and screening times: www.bfi.org.uk/whatson/node/8008?utm_source=20090123imax&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=20090123imaxCheers |
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haha!
Fan or no fan?? hehe....