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Post by crazy_asian_man on Nov 10, 2019 0:24:43 GMT -5
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Nov 10, 2019 17:28:51 GMT -5
I read that earlier. It’s not surprising if true but I also don’t know if I believe it either. Welling might be lying to keep a secret. A lot of people might be lying. Berlanti (and I think Guggenheim) confirmed himself that there is a scene with all three Supermen but I didn’t see Routh anywhere in the pictures on the Kent farm.
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Nov 12, 2019 2:25:44 GMT -5
I read that earlier. It’s not surprising if true but I also don’t know if I believe it either. Welling might be lying to keep a secret. A lot of people might be lying. Berlanti (and I think Guggenheim) confirmed himself that there is a scene with all three Supermen but I didn’t see Routh anywhere in the pictures on the Kent farm. I always go back to DS9 when one of their best episodes (it was the one with Nog locking himself away in the holodeck after having his leg blown up)- where supporting cast member who was only recurring was front and center for an entire episode.... I was hoping that would happen with the Wesley Shipp Flash appearance in a way with that other crossover--- and hoping that happens with Routh Superman- and I though there would be more with Welling as well- the Berliantiverse has the success at this point I imagine they could do that if they wanted now- but will they? But as you mentioned.... maybe they're keeping secrets and there IS more. Will see... |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Nov 12, 2019 11:13:47 GMT -5
Yeah but CAM while Nog may have been a supporting cast member he was also a RECURRING cast member. He’d been developed over time ON DS9 and had stories on DS9 and the DS9 audience was used to him. Him even JOINING Starfleet was a journey we’d followed him on so they’d done the proper build up to pay that off with a strong Nog centric episode. You can’t say that about characters like Shipps Barry or Rouths Clark within the Arrowverse itself. Just because some of the Arrowverse audience has a connection with those characters from watching their films or tv shows doesn’t mean they all have. A lot of the audience has never seen those shows or movies so they don’t have the connection with those characters as recurring characters.
The equivalent of what you’re talking about is doing an episode that is based around Arrowverse recurring characters like Jimmy Olsen, Martian Manhunter, Vibe, Killer Frost, Black Siren, etc. which they HAVE DONE. The quality of their featured episodes is up for debate but they’ve done what you’re talking about with the smaller supporting Arrowverse equivalents to what Nog was on DS9.
A better example of what you’re talking about is Scottys TNG episode RELICS or Spocks TNG two part episode Unification. Those were Episodes of TNG where characters from an old show guest starred and get heavily featured in episodes crafted around them. But even those are unique circumstances because those characters were still making regular on screen appearances in high profile films WHILE TNG was on the air. We haven’t seen Rouths Superman anywhere for over a decade and it was over 25 years since we’d last seen Shipps Barry Allen. They’re basically starting all over again cold in the Arrowverse.
But the good news is there are rumors that SR Superman gets a considerable amount of screen time for a guest star or at least some important moments.
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Nov 13, 2019 2:27:32 GMT -5
Yeah but CAM while Nog may have been a supporting cast member he was also a RECURRING cast member. He’d been developed over time ON DS9 and had stories on DS9 and the DS9 audience was used to him. Him even JOINING Starfleet was a journey we’d followed him on so they’d done the proper build up to pay that off with a strong Nog centric episode. You can’t say that about characters like Shipps Barry or Rouths Clark within the Arrowverse itself. Just because some of the Arrowverse audience has a connection with those characters from watching their films or tv shows doesn’t mean they all have. A lot of the audience has never seen those shows or movies so they don’t have the connection with those characters as recurring characters. The equivalent of what you’re talking about is doing an episode that is based around Arrowverse recurring characters like Jimmy Olsen, Martian Manhunter, Vibe, Killer Frost, Black Siren, etc. which they HAVE DONE. The quality of their featured episodes is up for debate but they’ve done what you’re talking about with the smaller supporting Arrowverse equivalents to what Nog was on DS9. A better example of what you’re talking about is Scottys TNG episode RELICS or Spocks TNG two part episode Unification. Those were Episodes of TNG where characters from an old show guest starred and get heavily featured in episodes crafted around them. But even those are unique circumstances because those characters were still making regular on screen appearances in high profile films WHILE TNG was on the air. We haven’t seen Rouths Superman anywhere for over a decade and it was over 25 years since we’d last seen Shipps Barry Allen. They’re basically starting all over again cold in the Arrowverse. But the good news is there are rumors that SR Superman gets a considerable amount of screen time for a guest star or at least some important moments. You make good points.... I need to step back and remember that it's a miracle that we even see Routh as Superman again, period.... but with the development of him appearing as Superman again AND the greenlighting of a new Superman tv show- I wish I understood more the mechanics of whether or not the Berlianti company or WB even considered Routh to lead a new Superman series, and/or if it was totally off the table, why? |
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Post by Metallo on Nov 13, 2019 20:42:51 GMT -5
Nothing wrong with wanting more but sometimes when you step back and look at why some decisions are made they make sense. I’m sure they’ve considered the same stuff we have. As for why they didn’t consider Routh to return as the lead of a new series or movie before now it’s because he was the lead of a failed Superman movie in their eyes. Rightly or wrongly they associated Routh with all that bad baggage. They thought it better to move on to something new. Same thing they’ve done with Cavill. Do you sink resources into something that failed (in their eyes) or into a fresh take that might have a better chance at success?
Jim Lee was apparently one of the people who fought for Routh to come back for COIE. It took some effort to make just this happen. Now that the return has been so positively received and depending on how his work and COIE is received they may consider doing something with Routh as Superman in the future. Much like when they got Matt Ryan a guest spot as Constantine on Arrow they’ve gotten the door open to do more. Love or hate Berlanti and his team...they’ve given more defunct DC projects a second chance at life than anyone else.
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Nov 14, 2019 0:17:03 GMT -5
Nothing wrong with wanting more but sometimes when you step back and look at why some decisions are made they make sense. I’m sure they’ve considered the same stuff we have. As for why they didn’t consider Routh to return as the lead of a new series or movie before now it’s because he was the lead of a failed Superman movie in their eyes. Rightly or wrongly they associated Routh with all that bad baggage. They thought it better to move on to something new. Same thing they’ve done with Cavill. Do you sink resources into something that failed (in their eyes) or into a fresh take that might have a better chance at success? Jim Lee was apparently one of the people who fought for Routh to come back for COIE. It took some effort to make just this happen. Now that the return has been so positively received and depending on how his work and COIE is received they may consider doing something with Routh as Superman in the future. Much like when they got Matt Ryan a guest spot as Constantine on Arrow they’ve gotten the door open to do more. Love or hate Berlanti and his team...they’ve given more defunct DC projects a second chance at life than anyone else. Good point! I think I'd also read that Lee fought for Routh. Didn't realize he was a fan of Routh as Superman- but, very cool! |
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Post by Metallo on Nov 14, 2019 9:23:15 GMT -5
If Welling doesn’t wear the suit you know some people will complain that it’s the creators fault but we know it’s all going to be on Welling. There no reason WB or the producers would say no. They clearly wanted Rosenbaum but he said no. Now that may just be them keeping secrets and he really does end up in this thing but that’s another instance of them wanting something but circumstances not allowing it. I see why Rosenbaum may have turned it down but I also see why they were being so secretive as to not tell him anything.
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Nov 15, 2019 1:29:06 GMT -5
If Welling doesn’t wear the suit you know some people will complain that it’s the creators fault but we know it’s all going to be on Welling. There no reason WB or the producers would say no. They clearly wanted Rosenbaum but he said no. Now that may just be them keeping secrets and he really does end up in this thing but that’s another instance of them wanting something but circumstances not allowing it. I see why Rosenbaum may have turned it down but I also see why they were being so secretive as to not tell him anything. I'm still trying to lower expectations.... good thing is, I generally wait until all the series are available on bluray/dvd--- so hopefully I'm not bummed out or disappointed by Crisis by the time they're all available next year!  |
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Post by Metallo on Dec 12, 2019 19:41:09 GMT -5
Looks like you did the right thing...in both cases! If the Tom Ellis Lucifer swerve has shown us anything maybe Welling and the producers are playing coy.
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Dec 12, 2019 19:54:15 GMT -5
Looks like you did the right thing...in both cases! If the Tom Ellis Lucifer swerve has shown us anything maybe Welling and the producers are playing coy. LOL! I think with Smallvillle the tv series having stuck in 'forever reset mode' for so many years, having a big jump forward with Clark & Lois with an actual sort-of 'happy ending' helped a lot. Also- Welling is good looking dude, but while I was wanting him in the costume in the show for so long, at this age- it's possible that he just wouldn't look that great in it now. What is interesting to me is if they 'visiit' or touch base with the alternate worlds like Smallville's Clark after the dust is settled--- assiming a new multiverse gets formed, or (like the DC comic), it all ends with just ONE world and some heroes in that weird 'zone' to leave things open for the future.... |
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Post by Metallo on Dec 12, 2019 20:08:53 GMT -5
The GOOD thing for smallville fans is even if Welling doesn’t do much this time it does open the door for the future. Ya never know. If this is the end for his Clark I’m fine with it because Smallville was on for ten years. I feel like we got plenty. It’s not like he had his run cuts short like Shipp or Routh. The only thing we really didn’t get from him was a live action non cgi scene in the full costume.
The guy is built like a tank these days so I think he’d look good in a costume I just don’t think if he does wear one it’ll be anything like the traditional Superman suit like the one Routh is wearing. There are rumors that he’s got a black suit if he does show up on the final two hours of Crisis. I can believe that. I think more than anything people just wanted fo see him in the suit. Even if he regains his powers temporarily if he just shows up in a costume once most will be happy.
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Dec 12, 2019 20:55:13 GMT -5
The GOOD thing for smallville fans is even if Welling doesn’t do much this time it does open the door for the future. Ya never know. If this is the end for his Clark I’m fine with it because Smallville was on for ten years. I feel like we got plenty. It’s not like he had his run cuts short like Shipp or Routh. The only thing we really didn’t get from him was a live action non cgi scene in the full costume. The guy is built like a tank these days so I think he’d look good in a costume I just don’t think if he does wear one it’ll be anything like the traditional Superman suit like the one Routh is wearing. There are rumors that he’s got a black suit if he does show up on the final two hours of Crisis. I can believe that. I think more than anything people just wanted fo see him in the suit. Even if he regains his powers temporarily if he just shows up in a costume once most will be happy. The most annoying thing to me in Smallville (besides Clana and a suprising amount of amnesia as a plot device over the years)- was Superboy referred to as 'the blur' as if it was a legendary name...... and the awful 's' leather jacket that seemed to be the series version of a compromise costume. I think it's telling that I have never seen anyone cosplay at a convention with that S jacket. |
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