dejan
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Post by dejan on Mar 6, 2021 4:51:30 GMT -5
Found this purely by accident
If you have never seen it before-enjoy!
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Mar 6, 2021 13:44:08 GMT -5
I’ve seen that. From around 91 or 92 I think. He had quite a few interviews with Cavett over the years. I can’t believe D!ck Cavett is still alive. I’ve always beens fan so I’m glad.
Have you seen this one? Reeve was brutally honest about Brando.
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Mar 6, 2021 14:49:06 GMT -5
Found this purely by accident If you have never seen it before-enjoy! Reeve was always a sharp articulate guy. The memoirs he had after he had to be in a wheelchair I found fascinating. He kind of turned his misfortune into a chance for self-exploration. His body being damaged didn't stop him from continuing to try to learn and grow. |
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Mar 6, 2021 15:01:40 GMT -5
I’ve seen that. From around 91 or 92 I think. He had quite a few interviews with Cavett over the years. I can’t believe D!ck Cavett is still alive. I’ve always beens fan so I’m glad. Have you seen this one? Reeve was brutally honest about Brando. I did not see that one... but I remembered the bit where Reeve mentioned somewhere that Brando didn't take it seriously until Reeve spoke up. If that was one of the FIRST scenes shot (because of Brando's time frame in the contract) - then imagine Reeve's disappointment and sheer fear that had to come up right off the bat to be starring as Superman and worry that nobody else was taking it seriously, but taking the money and running. Add to that- Kidder's mentioning how irreverent she could be when the cameras weren't rolling.... that HAD to drive Reeve crazy if he was already freaking out about making the biggest mistake of his life with taking on the role. (But then what relief he must have had after the movie came out and the reviews unanimously praised him) With so many of our pop 'heroes' now getting exposed for bad behavior (and much worse)- it's nice to see that the biggest 'sin' that Reeve might have had was that he took his craft (maybe yes maybe no) too seriously. But that he had a standard of being a role model to others when possible stands out on this. That's awesome. |
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dejan
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Post by dejan on Mar 6, 2021 15:34:21 GMT -5
I’ve seen that. From around 91 or 92 I think. He had quite a few interviews with Cavett over the years. I can’t believe D!ck Cavett is still alive. I’ve always beens fan so I’m glad. Have you seen this one? Reeve was brutally honest about Brando. Yes I had seen the Letterman one before--and you are right--that is a pretty brutal breakdown of Brando! But back in 1979 Reeve did this interview for a French/Canadian crew.......and he had nothing but positive stuff to say about Brando:(goto 8:57 in video) So between 1979 to 1982 , something snapped in Reeve with regards to his aura of Brando. |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Mar 6, 2021 16:42:10 GMT -5
I’ve seen that. From around 91 or 92 I think. He had quite a few interviews with Cavett over the years. I can’t believe D!ck Cavett is still alive. I’ve always beens fan so I’m glad. Have you seen this one? Reeve was brutally honest about Brando. Yes I had seen the Letterman one before--and you are right--that is a pretty brutal breakdown of Brando! But back in 1979 Reeve did this interview for a French/Canadian crew.......and he had nothing but positive stuff to say about Brando:(goto 8:57 in video) So between 1979 to 1982 , something snapped in Reeve with regards to his aura of Brando. Lol. It’s called becoming established and not giving an F. Early on in his career he probably felt he had to be more political and diplomatic. By the time he was doing Superman 3 he was a well established name and had seen more of Brando’s lazy bs. Look at how seriously Brando took Apocalypse Now and people like Reeve not only saw what was on screen but probably heard about his attitude through the Hollywood grapevine. I mean...Reeve WAS right. Everything he said was true. Brando coasted on his greatness and his reputation for at least the last 25 years of his career. |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Mar 6, 2021 16:49:12 GMT -5
I’ve seen that. From around 91 or 92 I think. He had quite a few interviews with Cavett over the years. I can’t believe D!ck Cavett is still alive. I’ve always beens fan so I’m glad. Have you seen this one? Reeve was brutally honest about Brando. I did not see that one... but I remembered the bit where Reeve mentioned somewhere that Brando didn't take it seriously until Reeve spoke up. If that was one of the FIRST scenes shot (because of Brando's time frame in the contract) - then imagine Reeve's disappointment and sheer fear that had to come up right off the bat to be starring as Superman and worry that nobody else was taking it seriously, but taking the money and running. Add to that- Kidder's mentioning how irreverent she could be when the cameras weren't rolling.... that HAD to drive Reeve crazy if he was already freaking out about making the biggest mistake of his life with taking on the role. (But then what relief he must have had after the movie came out and the reviews unanimously praised him) With so many of our pop 'heroes' now getting exposed for bad behavior (and much worse)- it's nice to see that the biggest 'sin' that Reeve might have had was that he took his craft (maybe yes maybe no) too seriously. But that he had a standard of being a role model to others when possible stands out on this. That's awesome. It’s always interesting to see a younger generation of actors talk about meeting their heroes from the generations before. People Reeve’s age grew up on Brando and Connery. It’s probably one reason Reeve went to Connery for advice since he was one of the few people who’d had an experience playing that type of larger than life iconic pop culture character Reeve could ask advice on. They say don’t meet your heroes. Sometimes it goes well and other times it’s a disaster. I’ve always enjoyed Clancy Browns stories of working with Sean Connery on Highlander. It wasn’t ideal and since it was a situation similar to Brando’s (big money for brief work) it’s very interesting to see it from the perspective of younger hungrier actor. |
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Mar 6, 2021 17:03:22 GMT -5
I did not see that one... but I remembered the bit where Reeve mentioned somewhere that Brando didn't take it seriously until Reeve spoke up. If that was one of the FIRST scenes shot (because of Brando's time frame in the contract) - then imagine Reeve's disappointment and sheer fear that had to come up right off the bat to be starring as Superman and worry that nobody else was taking it seriously, but taking the money and running. Add to that- Kidder's mentioning how irreverent she could be when the cameras weren't rolling.... that HAD to drive Reeve crazy if he was already freaking out about making the biggest mistake of his life with taking on the role. (But then what relief he must have had after the movie came out and the reviews unanimously praised him) With so many of our pop 'heroes' now getting exposed for bad behavior (and much worse)- it's nice to see that the biggest 'sin' that Reeve might have had was that he took his craft (maybe yes maybe no) too seriously. But that he had a standard of being a role model to others when possible stands out on this. That's awesome. It’s always interesting to see a younger generation of actors talk about meeting their heroes from the generations before. People Reeve’s age grew up on Brando and Connery. It’s probably one reason Reeve went to Connery for advice since he was one of the few people who’d had an experience playing that type of larger than life iconic pop culture character Reeve could ask advice on. They say don’t meet your heroes. Sometimes it goes well and other times it’s a disaster. I’ve always enjoyed Clancy Browns stories of working with Sean Connery on Highlander. It wasn’t ideal and since it was a situation similar to Brando’s (big money for brief work) it’s very interesting to see it from the perspective of younger hungrier actor. I totally agree with this: "Sometimes it goes well and other times it's a disaster."- I met some comic artists and writers that were fantastic, others who were complete a-holes. Bad thing is that it can taint your joy of their work... With the information overload age, though, I assume that actors and artists already know way too much about a person before even working with them on set! That's at least one (of many) things different about the 'then and now' with actors and how they may have viewed actors they look(ed) up to! |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Mar 6, 2021 17:52:09 GMT -5
It’s always interesting to see a younger generation of actors talk about meeting their heroes from the generations before. People Reeve’s age grew up on Brando and Connery. It’s probably one reason Reeve went to Connery for advice since he was one of the few people who’d had an experience playing that type of larger than life iconic pop culture character Reeve could ask advice on. They say don’t meet your heroes. Sometimes it goes well and other times it’s a disaster. I’ve always enjoyed Clancy Browns stories of working with Sean Connery on Highlander. It wasn’t ideal and since it was a situation similar to Brando’s (big money for brief work) it’s very interesting to see it from the perspective of younger hungrier actor. I totally agree with this: "Sometimes it goes well and other times it's a disaster."- I met some comic artists and writers that were fantastic, others who were complete a-holes. Bad thing is that it can taint your joy of their work... With the information overload age, though, I assume that actors and artists already know way too much about a person before even working with them on set! That's at least one (of many) things different about the 'then and now' with actors and how they may have viewed actors they look(ed) up to! There’s always been the Hollywood talk circle of actors being difficult. We’ve seen a lot of careers go down in flames because of it. It’s doubly true now because not only can people in the industry see it but we can too AND that kind of talk can go around the world in real time. Studios can still do some damage control but it’s much harder to hide if someone simply wants to go on Reddit and leak incidents anonymously. The Christian Bale/Terminator blow up was brutal to watch play out because we could actually hear his own words. Imagine that happening in 2021 with Twitter culture. |
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Mar 6, 2021 18:41:44 GMT -5
I totally agree with this: "Sometimes it goes well and other times it's a disaster."- I met some comic artists and writers that were fantastic, others who were complete a-holes. Bad thing is that it can taint your joy of their work... With the information overload age, though, I assume that actors and artists already know way too much about a person before even working with them on set! That's at least one (of many) things different about the 'then and now' with actors and how they may have viewed actors they look(ed) up to! There’s always been the Hollywood talk circle of actors being difficult. We’ve seen a lot of careers go down in flames because of it. It’s doubly true now because not only can people in the industry see it but we can too AND that kind of talk can go around the world in real time. Studios can still do some damage control but it’s much harder to hide if someone simply wants to go on Reddit and leak incidents anonymously. The Christian Bale/Terminator blow up was brutal to watch play out because we could actually hear his own words. Imagine that happening in 2021 with Twitter culture. I'm suprised that other actors even use the Bale reference- The world is so much 'no trial, accusations=guilty before trial' now, that I try not to get sucked into it, because judgements keep on getting too instant and no verification. Robert Burnett Meyer read this letter presumably from a Hollywood guy- It feels like it has a good ring of truth to it on the whole Hollywood behavior thing: www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ZtbVpy8ACo |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Mar 11, 2021 12:43:00 GMT -5
I think there’s obviously a standard or level that’s different for different people. Look at the recent controversy with Ezra Miller. WB seem to be staying silent to let it blow over. Compare that with the whole Whedon/Ray Fisher deal.
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Mar 11, 2021 14:30:25 GMT -5
Would not be suprising at all if things were politically motivated one way or another behind the scenes-
In the best circumstances, it all leads to enforced guidelines for a standard of acceptable behavior for people-
But...
Getting real, I don't think it's too different from any other company- there are people who know how to treat people well and other that don't or don't care.
With the money involved and so many wanting to climb over one another to be a star in one way or another, though-
It's probably not limited to Hollywood.... I'm reading Jackie Chan's autobio and it doesn't paint a great picture of different Hong Kong studios, either.
One actress from HK talked also about 'good' studios and 'bad' ones regarding behavior...
Anyhow- it would be nice if being able to get a good job in Hwood meant making people who would appreciate the opportunity and money and become better people, but...
People are people. Sucks when their behavior it can taint how you feel about entertainments that come from them.
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dejan
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Post by dejan on Mar 12, 2021 17:14:40 GMT -5
Yes I had seen the Letterman one before--and you are right--that is a pretty brutal breakdown of Brando! But back in 1979 Reeve did this interview for a French/Canadian crew.......and he had nothing but positive stuff to say about Brando:(goto 8:57 in video) So between 1979 to 1982 , something snapped in Reeve with regards to his aura of Brando. Lol. It’s called becoming established and not giving an F. Early on in his career he probably felt he had to be more political and diplomatic. By the time he was doing Superman 3 he was a well established name and had seen more of Brando’s lazy bs. Look at how seriously Brando took Apocalypse Now and people like Reeve not only saw what was on screen but probably heard about his attitude through the Hollywood grapevine. I mean...Reeve WAS right. Everything he said was true. Brando coasted on his greatness and his reputation for at least the last 25 years of his career. That's true!-although in IMHO Brando's display in The Last Tango In Paris outstrips what he did in Apocalypse, The Godfather and indeed Superman(be it I or II).There maybe a correlation between the fact he was the lead character in Tango, where as he was ultimately only a bit part player(but still immensely significant!!!) in his 3 other 1970s cinematic outings. With regards to Superman the only problem is that it becomes difficult to gage exactly just how good was Brando's performance , as deemed by his fellow cast members and in particular , Reeve himself. Reeve in 1979 insinuated that Brando was fantastic(and by association, his performance as Jorel). But in 1982, Reeve explicitly says that Brando took the money and ran(and that he simply did not care)!. Those aspersions cast by Reeve are not to be taken lightly and my personal interpretation is that Reeve actually thought that Brando's performance was not good at all! The 1992 Cavett interview seems to add some credence to this hypothesis. Now that we have all the Brando footage(at least that's what we think!) at our disposal as audience members ,we can make our own personal evaluations with regards to the quality of Brando's performance. And IMHO , Brando's performance as Jorel is commensurate with the societal role of the character(senior scientist) and the predicament of the planet. It is therefore a beautifully restrained performance-credit also goes to Donner here too. But in the Mank script for SII, the repowering scene requires that Brando exhibit some kind of emotional pain as his final chunk of energy drains away. In the Donner cut we don't get to see that. I postulated in another thread that maybe this absolutely crucial footage(maybe only lasting a few seconds) was shot, but lost, or that it was indeed shot, but simply not deemed good enough not only by Baird and Donner in 1977/78 , but also by Thau and Donner in 2005/06. This could be the hypothetical reason why Reeve is so pissed off with Brando in the 1982 Letterman interview and somewhat abrasive(Brando help me out with my work!) on the 1992 Cavett show. |
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Mar 12, 2021 20:10:14 GMT -5
Lol. It’s called becoming established and not giving an F. Early on in his career he probably felt he had to be more political and diplomatic. By the time he was doing Superman 3 he was a well established name and had seen more of Brando’s lazy bs. Look at how seriously Brando took Apocalypse Now and people like Reeve not only saw what was on screen but probably heard about his attitude through the Hollywood grapevine. I mean...Reeve WAS right. Everything he said was true. Brando coasted on his greatness and his reputation for at least the last 25 years of his career. That's true!-although in IMHO Brando's display in The Last Tango In Paris outstrips what he did in Apocalypse, The Godfather and indeed Superman(be it I or II).There maybe a correlation between the fact he was the lead character in Tango, where as he was ultimately only a bit part player(but still immensely significant!!!) in his 3 other 1970s cinematic outings. With regards to Superman the only problem is that it becomes difficult to gage exactly just how good was Brando's performance , as deemed by his fellow cast members and in particular , Reeve himself. Reeve in 1979 insinuated that Brando was fantastic(and by association, his performance as Jorel). But in 1982, Reeve explicitly says that Brando took the money and ran(and that he simply did not care)!. Those aspersions cast by Reeve are not to be taken lightly and my personal interpretation is that Reeve actually thought that Brando's performance was not good at all! The 1992 Cavett interview seems to add some credence to this hypothesis. Now that we have all the Brando footage(at least that's what we think!) at our disposal as audience members ,we can make our own personal evaluations with regards to the quality of Brando's performance. And IMHO , Brando's performance as Jorel is commensurate with the societal role of the character(senior scientist) and the predicament of the planet. It is therefore a beautifully restrained performance-credit also goes to Donner here too. But in the Mank script for SII, the repowering scene requires that Brando exhibit some kind of emotional pain as his final chunk of energy drains away. In the Donner cut we don't get to see that. I postulated in another thread that maybe this absolutely crucial footage(maybe only lasting a few seconds) was shot, but lost, or that it was indeed shot, but simply not deemed good enough not only by Baird and Donner in 1977/78 , but also by Thau and Donner in 2005/06. This could be the hypothetical reason why Reeve is so pissed off with Brando in the 1982 Letterman interview and somewhat abrasive(Brando help me out with my work!) on the 1992 Cavett show. I'm a believer of 'whatever works' in the end for film as long as nobody is doing anything improper crossing a line.... Brando's performance seems great in STM to me- even if he's reading off of cue cards the whole time and probably no small effort of Donner and Baird making it a fantastic performance in the editing room with Donner's getting enough takes to make it work. We know Brando only used cue cards and didn't take it that seriously until Reeve kind of pushed him to. Reeve sounded like he regarded Brando as a hero--- at first. Working with Brando was most likely a giant blow to his feelings on working with older actors he respected. Reeve trained in the theatre, with established rules and general ideas of what was acceptable behavior. To work with Brando who didn't give a damn during a role where Reeve felt like he had the most to lose I'm sure pissed him off to no end. If the performance was any good, it didn't matter because it did seem Brando broke Reeve's heart a bit by not being a mentor or an example he could look up to. |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Mar 14, 2021 16:54:22 GMT -5
Lol. It’s called becoming established and not giving an F. Early on in his career he probably felt he had to be more political and diplomatic. By the time he was doing Superman 3 he was a well established name and had seen more of Brando’s lazy bs. Look at how seriously Brando took Apocalypse Now and people like Reeve not only saw what was on screen but probably heard about his attitude through the Hollywood grapevine. I mean...Reeve WAS right. Everything he said was true. Brando coasted on his greatness and his reputation for at least the last 25 years of his career. That's true!-although in IMHO Brando's display in The Last Tango In Paris outstrips what he did in Apocalypse, The Godfather and indeed Superman(be it I or II).There maybe a correlation between the fact he was the lead character in Tango, where as he was ultimately only a bit part player(but still immensely significant!!!) in his 3 other 1970s cinematic outings. With regards to Superman the only problem is that it becomes difficult to gage exactly just how good was Brando's performance , as deemed by his fellow cast members and in particular , Reeve himself. Reeve in 1979 insinuated that Brando was fantastic(and by association, his performance as Jorel). But in 1982, Reeve explicitly says that Brando took the money and ran(and that he simply did not care)!. Those aspersions cast by Reeve are not to be taken lightly and my personal interpretation is that Reeve actually thought that Brando's performance was not good at all! The 1992 Cavett interview seems to add some credence to this hypothesis. Now that we have all the Brando footage(at least that's what we think!) at our disposal as audience members ,we can make our own personal evaluations with regards to the quality of Brando's performance. And IMHO , Brando's performance as Jorel is commensurate with the societal role of the character(senior scientist) and the predicament of the planet. It is therefore a beautifully restrained performance-credit also goes to Donner here too. But in the Mank script for SII, the repowering scene requires that Brando exhibit some kind of emotional pain as his final chunk of energy drains away. In the Donner cut we don't get to see that. I postulated in another thread that maybe this absolutely crucial footage(maybe only lasting a few seconds) was shot, but lost, or that it was indeed shot, but simply not deemed good enough not only by Baird and Donner in 1977/78 , but also by Thau and Donner in 2005/06. This could be the hypothetical reason why Reeve is so pissed off with Brando in the 1982 Letterman interview and somewhat abrasive(Brando help me out with my work!) on the 1992 Cavett show. Brando is fine in Superman. Problem is we’ve all seen all his others work and we know he could do much better. His costars also got to witness how he worked by that point. The cue cards, the earpiece, showing up on sets overweight, trying to con his way into somehow doing even less. He’d always been pretty selfish, overconfident, and vindictive but Reeve was right by the later half of his career he was coasting on his beloved status. His “fine” is still better than most actors “great” though. It’s why he still makes the scenes he’s in light up. And like you said Donner and co knew how to use him and what the got from him. Baird deserved all the praise he got for his editing that’s for sure. John Williams work can elevate anything....even Brando’s acting. |
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Mar 14, 2021 21:07:46 GMT -5
That's true!-although in IMHO Brando's display in The Last Tango In Paris outstrips what he did in Apocalypse, The Godfather and indeed Superman(be it I or II).There maybe a correlation between the fact he was the lead character in Tango, where as he was ultimately only a bit part player(but still immensely significant!!!) in his 3 other 1970s cinematic outings. With regards to Superman the only problem is that it becomes difficult to gage exactly just how good was Brando's performance , as deemed by his fellow cast members and in particular , Reeve himself. Reeve in 1979 insinuated that Brando was fantastic(and by association, his performance as Jorel). But in 1982, Reeve explicitly says that Brando took the money and ran(and that he simply did not care)!. Those aspersions cast by Reeve are not to be taken lightly and my personal interpretation is that Reeve actually thought that Brando's performance was not good at all! The 1992 Cavett interview seems to add some credence to this hypothesis. Now that we have all the Brando footage(at least that's what we think!) at our disposal as audience members ,we can make our own personal evaluations with regards to the quality of Brando's performance. And IMHO , Brando's performance as Jorel is commensurate with the societal role of the character(senior scientist) and the predicament of the planet. It is therefore a beautifully restrained performance-credit also goes to Donner here too. But in the Mank script for SII, the repowering scene requires that Brando exhibit some kind of emotional pain as his final chunk of energy drains away. In the Donner cut we don't get to see that. I postulated in another thread that maybe this absolutely crucial footage(maybe only lasting a few seconds) was shot, but lost, or that it was indeed shot, but simply not deemed good enough not only by Baird and Donner in 1977/78 , but also by Thau and Donner in 2005/06. This could be the hypothetical reason why Reeve is so pissed off with Brando in the 1982 Letterman interview and somewhat abrasive(Brando help me out with my work!) on the 1992 Cavett show. Brando is fine in Superman. Problem is we’ve all seen all his others work and we know he could do much better. His costars also got to witness how he worked by that point. The cue cards, the earpiece, showing up on sets overweight, trying to con his way into somehow doing even less. He’d always been pretty selfish, overconfident, and vindictive but Reeve was right by the later half of his career he was coasting on his beloved status. His “fine” is still better than most actors “great” though. It’s why he still makes the scenes he’s in light up. And like you said Donner and co knew how to use him and what the got from him. Baird deserved all the praise he got for his editing that’s for sure. John Williams work can elevate anything....even Brando’s acting. Strangely, I would have thought Gregory Peck would have been much better as Jor-el.... but Donner mentioned that PECK was a bit of an a-hole while directing "The Omen"- so sad... |
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Metallo
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Post by Metallo on Mar 14, 2021 21:36:26 GMT -5
Brando is fine in Superman. Problem is we’ve all seen all his others work and we know he could do much better. His costars also got to witness how he worked by that point. The cue cards, the earpiece, showing up on sets overweight, trying to con his way into somehow doing even less. He’d always been pretty selfish, overconfident, and vindictive but Reeve was right by the later half of his career he was coasting on his beloved status. His “fine” is still better than most actors “great” though. It’s why he still makes the scenes he’s in light up. And like you said Donner and co knew how to use him and what the got from him. Baird deserved all the praise he got for his editing that’s for sure. John Williams work can elevate anything....even Brando’s acting. Strangely, I would have thought Gregory Peck would have been much better as Jor-el.... but Donner mentioned that PECK was a bit of an a-hole while directing "The Omen"- so sad... Well I think Peck was still dealing with his grief over his sons death during the making of the Omen. I know Donner said they had some disagreements but not that they went at it through the entire shoot the way he has with other actors. |
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Post by crazy_asian_man on Mar 15, 2021 12:40:06 GMT -5
Strangely, I would have thought Gregory Peck would have been much better as Jor-el.... but Donner mentioned that PECK was a bit of an a-hole while directing "The Omen"- so sad... Well I think Peck was still dealing with his grief over his sons death during the making of the Omen. I know Donner said they had some disagreements but not that they went at it through the entire shoot the way he has with other actors. I generally make sure I take a grain of salt whenver I read of bad behavior, but I was suprised that (If I recall right) Peck slugged Donner in the face. That's kind of above and beyond... but grief or not, if so, I wouldn't be quick to recommend an actor if they're going through something difficult or can't get it together by the time of the shoot, either. If not for the behind he scenes... I would definitely feel Peck would have been a great Jor-el, with better timing, perhaps. |
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