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Post by stargazer01 on Sept 30, 2008 23:55:24 GMT -5
It feels sacreligious to advocate cutting Noel Neil out of the movie...but... I hate that scene. Passionately. We have the same reservations, but when viewed objectively one cannot deny that scene hurts the film for a variety of reasons. And to think it was the FIRST scene of the movie.  I never understood the hate for that scene. I like it. It stablishes just how evil, cold and calculating Lex actually is in order to obtain what he wants. Now, the scene with Lex that makes me cringe a little is the last one with him and Kitty on the tiny island.....without gasoline......I don't like it when he yells like that to her. but I don't hate it either. LOL! |
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Post by MAVERICK on Oct 1, 2008 0:41:28 GMT -5
Superman was not stalking Lois or being a peeping tom. Superman derived no pleasure from his actions. He was eavesdropping. If that's a cardinal sin then we're all going to heck. Also, it not like he has never done before. He has done it in practically every incarnation, even in STM to some point......."Pink " ;D. But people only complained when it happened in SR... [/b] [/quote] THANKYOUTHANKYOUTHANKYOUTHANKYOUTHANKYOUTHANKYOU! |
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ye5man
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Post by ye5man on Oct 1, 2008 3:51:49 GMT -5
He's never eavesdropped on her private conversations before; its not what he's about.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2008 4:17:05 GMT -5
No, he just grabbed her crotch while going to his new desk.  |
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Post by Jimbo on Oct 1, 2008 4:20:54 GMT -5
He's never eavesdropped on her private conversations before; its not what he's about. At the end of STM, wasn't he listening to Lois talk to Jimmy? It showed him flying and her talking. I think the jury is still out on that one. |
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Post by MAVERICK on Oct 1, 2008 4:58:40 GMT -5
He's never eavesdropped on her private conversations before; its not what he's about. If you needed to know if someone you loved, still loved you, & you had the ability to know, you would use it. He has that ability & used it. I buy it & I dont think it makes him any less super. Love makes ya do funny things. That said, I can see why some would whine about it. But, as for me, I'm fine with it. So are plenty of others. |
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Legsy
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Post by Legsy on Oct 1, 2008 9:05:46 GMT -5
EXAAAAAACTLY!
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Post by thepariah on Oct 1, 2008 9:21:01 GMT -5
Alright, who's going to out-exaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaactly each other here? ;D
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2008 10:47:34 GMT -5
Love makes you do stupid things.
Although Superman eavesdropping on Lois after finding out she's with someone else despite still loving her IS ridiculously stupid and could never happen in the history of the universe ever to ANYONE of a good moral character.
EVER.
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Legsy
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Post by Legsy on Oct 1, 2008 11:00:34 GMT -5
Alright, who's going to out-exaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaactly each other here? ;D Well, MAV is known for saying it. We're just copying MAV. |
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Legsy
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Post by Legsy on Oct 1, 2008 11:00:59 GMT -5
Love makes you do stupid things. Although Superman eavesdropping on Lois after finding out she's with someone else despite still loving her IS ridiculously stupid and could never happen in the history of the universe ever to ANYONE of a good moral character. EVER. Ever-ever? |
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Post by KaptainKrypton on Oct 1, 2008 11:31:51 GMT -5
"stalker"man is another one i'd omit... I love that scene. It's so full of subtext. We see Superman as the outsider, the alien, and I see so much regret in his eyes. Besides, it was shocking to him to find Lois in a new relationship...and with a son! After all, he thought she was the type of girl that would never settle down. And ditto to what Kirok said as well. Superman was not stalking Lois or being a peeping tom. Superman derived no pleasure from his actions. He was eavesdropping. If that's a cardinal sin then we're all going to heck. Also, it not like he has never done before. He has done it in practically every incarnation: the comics, Lois & Clark, Smallville, and even in STM to some point......."Pink" ;D. But people only complained when it happened in SR... Co-sign. The double standard irks me to no end with regards to the whole "Stalkerman" scene. Supes came across to me more as Peter Pan as opposed to some weirdo creep. I mean, he flew off and cried for pete's sake. He cried! If anything, I'd be griping more about him crying. |
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Post by stargazer01 on Oct 1, 2008 11:33:20 GMT -5
He's never eavesdropped on her private conversations before; its not what he's about. If you needed to know if someone you loved, still loved you, & you had the ability to know, you would use it. He has that ability & used it.
I buy it & I dont think it makes him any less super.
Love makes ya do funny things.That said, I can see why some would whine about it. But, as for me, I'm fine with it. So are plenty of others. My thoughts exactly. He was just being 'the fly on the wall'. Was it wrong? Yes, but understandable due to the circumstances. Besides, Superman on film has been very naive and inexperienced when it comes to romantic relationships. He was after all raised on a farm by humans; so he was just being 'human', and humans, no matter how good and moral we try to be, are flawed and make mistakes. Yeah, I still love that scene. It showed me that Superman has a soul. I just like my Superman a little bit flawed. It seems more real to me than the perfect hero that never does wrong. Also, the worst thing he ever did, in the movies, was renouncing to his powers just to sleep with a girl.. yeah, the girl he loves but he was being way too selfish, IMO. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2008 11:41:05 GMT -5
Superman listens in on people ALL the goddamn time. Him hovering over the earth? <GASP!> Guess what he's doing?! He's eavesdropping! OH MY GOD! What a HORRIBLE MAN!
How did Superman know where Lois lives in STM? Hmm? Kinda stalkerish that he'd know that, yeah?
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Post by stargazer01 on Oct 1, 2008 11:44:42 GMT -5
[quote author=kaptainkrypton board=superman thread=534 post=14260 time=1222878711 Co-sign. The double standard irks me to no end with regards to the whole "Stalkerman" scene. Supes came across to me more as Peter Pan as opposed to some weirdo creep. I mean, he flew off and cried for pete's sake. He cried! If anything, I'd be griping more about him crying. [/quote] Yup, he was punished for it. Poor Supes. And yes, I really felt for him; not only he heard Lois saying she never loved him, but he was already feeling the pain of the realization that Krypton and his people had indeed perished. He was feeling more lonely than ever.  |
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Legsy
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Post by Legsy on Oct 1, 2008 12:29:17 GMT -5
Superman listens in on people ALL the goddamn time. Him hovering over the earth? <GASP!> Guess what he's doing?! He's eavesdropping! OH MY GOD! What a HORRIBLE MAN! How did Superman know where Lois lives in STM? Hmm? Kinda stalkerish that he'd know that, yeah? BAH! Stalkerman! If I were a citizen of Metropolis I'd sue his arse for invasion of privacy! |
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EvilSupes
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Post by EvilSupes on Oct 1, 2008 12:58:47 GMT -5
Damn superheroes, who needs 'em.  |
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Post by thepariah on Oct 1, 2008 14:19:09 GMT -5
I mean, he flew off and cried for pete's sake. He cried! If anything, I'd be griping more about him crying. Bah, he almost-cried. I didn't see no Indian tear rolling down his cheek. ;D It was more of a wibble, lol. [/splitting_hairs] Superman listens in on people ALL the goddamn time. Him hovering over the earth? <GASP!> Guess what he's doing?! He's eavesdropping! OH MY GOD! What a HORRIBLE MAN! How did Superman know where Lois lives in STM? Hmm? Kinda stalkerish that he'd know that, yeah? Let's face it, he IS a stalker. It just so happens he's only benignly obsessed and never actually does anything squicky.  I can just imagine all the millions of people he hears having sex every day...  Lois: "Ooh, Clark, where'd you learn to do that?? I thought this was your first time!" Superman: "...um...I...studied a bit." *guilty look* ;D |
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Post by thepariah on Oct 1, 2008 14:20:11 GMT -5
Damn superheroes, who needs 'em. "Damn whippersnapper, get off my fire escape!!" ;D |
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Post by bgshw44 on Oct 1, 2008 14:31:35 GMT -5
If we had all the material, i think a pretty damn good movie good be made, and i would love to see it!
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Legsy
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Post by Legsy on Oct 1, 2008 15:14:55 GMT -5
I would love to see what Bryan Singer had invisioned. I hope we do get to see it. Sooner or later.
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Post by Ollie W on Oct 1, 2008 23:56:32 GMT -5
I would love to see what Bryan Singer had invisioned. I hope we do get to see it. Sooner or later. That's just it I don't think Singer's original intentions showed up on screen. His story was great, but once he was given what he wanted I think his ego took over and the whole Superman returns became a back story. All the Smallville scenes should’ve been retained. They’re really the only thing Singer shot well. It’s such an important part of the film and is unfortunately rushed through. It feels sacreligious to advocate cutting Noel Neil out of the movie...but... I hate that scene. Passionately. I agree and it'd be the first scene I would cut. As I said before SR is far too long considering how little happens. This scene simply isn't necessary and if anything cutting it makes it more humorous when Lois sarcastically remarks how Lex reclaimed his fortune. "stalker"man is another one i'd omit... Initially I wasn't comfortable with this scene but I'm now ok with it. In a movie where Superman ventures into a young child’s (even if it's his son) bedroom in the middle of the night I don't think it's very out of place. |
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Post by Jor-L5150 on Oct 4, 2008 16:11:41 GMT -5
Now with regards to the topic at hand. I agree the extended cut of SR should be available, but honestly SR is more in need of a re-cut rather then an extended cut. It's long enough as it is. SR would be best served by a recut deleting some material from the theatrical version while at the same time utilizing additional material from the 'original' version. For example: SCENES I WOULD CUT -Noel Neil's scene. It's just...weird for many reasons, and the source of Luthor's affluence is probably better left ambiguous. He obviously had some source of wealth in the original films, so let's just keep it at that. -The Smallville flashback. It's completely extraneous. I see what Singer was trying to do with it, showing how once Clark and Jason discovered their powers they no longer needing their glasses/inhaler, but while that's fine for Jason, Clark's powers never worked that way. -Brando's voiceovers. I know it seems like blasphemy, but I think it's overdone. -Superman in the ER. This felt very "Lois & Clark"-esque. Superman in mundane situations like in a courtroom, in a jail cell, in the hospital, etc. It doesn't feel right. Fade to black when he crashes back to Earth, and fade back up on the "Superman Dead" headline. It's effective, and would not only do away with the ER scene, but Kryptonite shard still being INSIDE Superman's body while he LIFTED A CONTINENT. That just wouldn't be possible. -Lex and Kitty on the island. Humourous in theory, but really...how are they supposed to get off? SCENES I WOULD RE-INSERT -The infamous Return to Krypton scene. -ALL of the deleted/alternate Smallville scenes: Scrabble w/Ben Hubbard, Clark waking up, burying the spaceship and reading the old newspapers, and the alternate Martha scene w/Ben Hubbard and the awesome transition from the baseball to the Daily Planet. -The alternte beginning of the Lex/Kitty scene on the boat, with the wig. -The approach to the Fortress where Kumar has dialogue. -The sub-plot of Jimmy on hard times with his photography, which includes the extended bar scene where Clark says he's "always had a pretty high tolerance." -Clark's original first transformation into Superman where he changes in the storage room, paying off the scene where he'd placed his luggage there. -Luthor retrieving the crystals before leaving the boat. -The plotpoint of Luthor planting the story about Krypton, tricking Superman to leave Earth. i HIGHLY agree with that last point ! the only exception ihave with you is the flashback scenes- i think they are pretty cool and it works for me that he is feeling nostalgiac while all around him everything is on its ear. i was unaware of a scne of lex recovering the crystals..THAT would be useful. |
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Post by Jack Tripper on Oct 4, 2008 16:34:51 GMT -5
maybe they'll put this back in the full cut too. lol.
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Post by Jor-L5150 on Oct 4, 2008 20:03:52 GMT -5
Superman listens in on people ALL the goddamn time. Him hovering over the earth? <GASP!> Guess what he's doing?! He's eavesdropping! OH MY GOD! What a HORRIBLE MAN! How did Superman know where Lois lives in STM? Hmm? Kinda stalkerish that he'd know that, yeah? BAH! Stalkerman! If I were a citizen of Metropolis I'd sue his arse for invasion of privacy! superman works for dick cheney. |
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