Superman II fan edits

[ChrisM]

i would integrate the bullets and fire, but not the ice. it looks more like confetti.

[crazy_asian_man]

Let's say I get Premiere Pro...

for a newb, how much of a learning curve would you say there is?

what would you say are the biggest technical challenges with the editing process? (not the creative decisions... just the technical issues with splicing video and audio, learning how to use the editing software, etc.)

for minor edits - like with STM for example - how much time would be reasonably required to do a through job?

If you are a newb- then I'd reccomend maybe something simpler.... but.... it depends on how much long-term use you really think you'll have with this thing, imo.

I had to do editing in the past for working on corporate videos- so I had no choice but to learn the software that the company bought. But, I also was shooting stuff as a hobby on my free time that I wanted to edit--- so taking the time to learn was a no-brainer.

But- if I was only planning on doing a simple edit, and put it away, maybe Pro isn't worth the time/effort.

"Elements" versions usually are simplified versions (I have not tried the Elements myself), but may or may not give you all the flexibility you need if you want something more precise or an option or two that the professional version offers.

Oftentimes, 'educational' versions are discounted versions of the same software, but have the inability to upgrade at a relatively cheap rate.

So-- depends on how much time/effort you want to put in. People I know adapt to new software at different rates--- so it's difficult to say.... (Learning Final Cut Pro took a couple of weeks to really nail it comfortably as a comparison, if curious- and I'm not the fastest in picking up software)

[TylerDurden389]

Whichever program you decide on, find tutorial videos of how to do whichever effects you plan on doing, and "study them well, my son" lol.

[crazy_asian_man]

Has anybody seen RKS's cut? I downloaded it recently and, having scanned through it, I'm mighty impressed. It includes just about everything I'd want in there (such as the pink bear and memory kiss scenes) plus the way he did the opening titles is PHENOMENAL. They're basically the Donner Cut ones in the style of STM, but with the Lester recap seamlessly integrated into them. Plus it has the opening Daily Planet scene shot by Donner (minus Lois' jump) AS WELL as the Paris sequence, with the Donner Cut release of the villains that features the cool vortex/Phantom Zone split. And there's no spinning the world back, while including Lester's brilliant ending. Having looked through it, about the only thing I don't like is the way there's footage from other sources spliced into Zod's speech to give it a more global feel. I applaud the effort, but I really don't like it when fan-edits include secondary footage that doesn't really match the main body of the film, as I find it pulls you out of the experience. Apart from that, though, it looks great. Anyone seen it?

Did see RKS' cut. Agree that it's great stuff.

About the other bit-

I'm FINALLY starting to agree that footage from other sources needs to be mostly from the same era, which is what Selutron did (plus he did some rotoscoping to subtract Michael Caine) - to fill in areas the way that the Lester footage fills in story gaps, (to a degree) although totally not under Donner/Bairds' quality control.

I guess it's a miracle that WB finally said 'yes' at all to greenlighting the Donner cut- but, as Tylerdurden mentioned before- rather than giving Superman fans resolution, it opened up the gates of speculation even further on how Donner would have finished it.

Donner himself- even if he weren't working on "16 Blocks" at the time--- Sounds like his aesthetics have changed so much, (and his films have changed as well over time), that- unlike Ridley Scott's situation it seemed in restoring "Blade Runner"----

Donner wasn't driven to totally go back to the original vision he may have had, nor overcome the obstacles by tossing money into it via CGI characters or whatnot (After all, he didn't even get paid for the participation he put in)--- he'd said that he didn't look at the footage for a long time, and that, frankly, he was embarrassed by some of it-

So- he was probably right that he might not have been the right person to go back after all this time..... but Thau's decisions seem to show that he just wasn't the right person for the job- but maybe he was the ONLY one that was able to have the access to have the job. Who knows?

Anyhow, since the IRC doesn't seem to have any hope yet of coming out on hi-res letterbox dvd soon--- and a recut seems non-existant on WB's radar.....

I long and hope for the fan cut that can overcome all the hurdles and present an ideal Donner cut that looks and FEELS like the Donner cut we should have had.

[joey m]

I've been wondering about a version that shows what it would have been like if Donner had come back but everything else is still realistically what would have happened, and not an idealized situation. For the sake of argument, would it be so radically different from what Lester ended up doing? Let's figure Donner is still bound to the same schedule and budget that Lester had, and still has to work with the Salkinds. They probably wouldn't have had Brando, it took decades (and ultimately his death) before that was issue was ironed out. (Maybe Donner would have come to the same conclusion that Lester did about starting the movie off with some kind of incident like the Paris scene to get Superman in action early, I can't imagine the 80s sequel mentality allowing them to wait so long for Superman to do something). I like to think Donner and Mankiewicz would have come up with a better ending though.

[crazy_asian_man]

I've been wondering about a version that shows what it would have been like if Donner had come back but everything else is still realistically what would have happened, and not an idealized situation. For the sake of argument, would it be so radically different from what Lester ended up doing? Let's figure Donner is still bound to the same schedule and budget that Lester had, and still has to work with the Salkinds. They probably wouldn't have had Brando, it took decades (and ultimately his death) before that was issue was ironed out.

That's an area where I really wish would be discussed.....

If Donner were NOT allowed (even by WB) to use Brando at all....
If Donner had to stick to the same schedule & budget Lester had.....

It's a huge leap that Donner would, given how frustrated he was with the producers--- but if WB sat Donner down & said that the only choice was to either work with them or have Lester totally destroy it-
presuming that was the case-

* I think strongly that Donner would recast (and have to) rather than use Susannah York. The father/son story was too important to give up.

* The action would be SERIOUS- but scaled down, probably.

* The ending is an odd one, though, to resolve. Since they used the time-reversal ending for the first one---- how ELSE would they be able to resolve Lois' memory loss?

Reeve said in an older interview that he suggested the kiss, as something graceful- versus the scripted bit where he uses his heat vision on a glass of water & gives it to Lois.

I think if Donner went with this, he would have made the setting and context more significant than the cheap office setting where Lester staged the memory kiss.

If nothing else, if scaled down- we would have seen the Villains not be as comedic as Lester portrayed them, with layered performances, and that might have been more than enough to make up for the lower budget.

[joey m]

Donner seems very fond of traditional movie romance and the happily ever after ending. I think maybe he would have just had them look across the bullpen and go make out in the closet, music swells, the end.

[EvilSupes]

Does anyone know anything about this "Deja Vu" edit? It's supposed to be one of the best S2 edits available. The whole concept in which the edit attempts to join Lester's and Donner's versions is very unique I think.

So now, my list of S2 edits to watch is:

S2 CAM edit
S2 Booshman's Redux
S2 tyler edit
S2 Deja Vu cut

Plus, I still need to watch the blu-ray remaster of S2 theatrical, and then maybe the Donner Cut.

I'm gonna be worn out from S2 by the end of this. ;D

[crazy_asian_man]

Does anyone know anything about this "Deja Vu" edit? It's supposed to be one of the best S2 edits available. The whole concept in which the edit attempts to join Lester's and Donner's versions is very unique I think.

Haven't watched it, but am intrigued by the idea of the time-reversal starting a new timeline, to be able to incorporate both Donner and Lester versions. If the editor was able to pull it off without it seeming overly long and/or not 'knock' you out of the story with it's alternate timeline thing, it'd be pretty impressive!

[TylerDurden389]

Jun 16, 2011 5:03:58 GMT -5 EvilSupes said:

So now, my list of S2 edits to watch is:

S2 CAM edit
S2 Booshman's Redux
S2 tyler edit
S2 Deja Vu cut

I'm gonna be worn out from S2 by the end of this. ;D

Make sure the check out the RKS cut as discussed earlier. If he has any copies left I'd say PM Jimbo for a copy of his as well. And even though he's not around anymore, OneKingProd's "Versimilitude Cut" was great at the moment as well (until better fan cuts were made).

As for being worn out, don't make the mistake I made and watch them all back to back (each day anyway). Maybe you should watch one cut, wait a week, watch another, rinse and repeat. And since you're doing this to find the one that "gets it right", I would suggest taking notes. Make a checklist of all the things you like and don't like for each individual cut. If you plan on making your own cut someday it'll make it a lot easier when it comes time to put all the pieces (scenes) together.

[crazy_asian_man]

As for being worn out, don't make the mistake I made and watch them all back to back (each day anyway). Maybe you should watch one cut, wait a week, watch another, rinse and repeat.

Great point, plus, it helps avoid a brain aneurism from an overload of too much Superman II.....

[TylerDurden389]

Jun 16, 2011 10:32:53 GMT -5 crazy_asian_man said:

Great point, plus, it helps avoid a brain aneurism from an overload of too much Superman II.

Lol. Superman 2-much.

[subzero]

Im looking for the fan edit which includes ursa's line 'men to kill' and the young boy getting killed in houston