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Post by EnriqueH on Aug 9, 2016 15:36:30 GMT -5
Well, not bullying but intolerance and personal attacks.
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Post by EnriqueH on Aug 9, 2016 15:27:57 GMT -5
I really thought the Iron Man vs Captain America/Winter Soldier is the crowning achievement of superhero fight scenes.
Not sure anything else comes close.
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Post by EnriqueH on Aug 9, 2016 15:25:22 GMT -5
Yeah I actually agree with you. I'm just giving Cavill the benefit of the doubt.
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Post by EnriqueH on Aug 9, 2016 10:45:37 GMT -5
I wonder if Snyder will direct?
I hope not.
But I do hope Cavill's Superman finds redemption. I've said it before: he's kinda reminding me of Timothy Dalton/Pierce Brosnan who were great Bonds without a great Bond movie.
Not that Cavill has entirely transcended bad scripts, but I do think his Superman hasn't really had a chance to shine with MOS being a disappointment and his role being (reportedly) cut severely in BvS.
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Post by EnriqueH on Aug 8, 2016 20:47:02 GMT -5
I'll probably watch it.
Expectations are low anyway after MOS, BvS and now Suicide Squad were all pretty ordinary.
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Post by EnriqueH on May 19, 2016 0:09:43 GMT -5
I think you're right, Metallo.
Snyder needs to go.
He's had 2 huge chances to make this thing work, but he's dropped the ball. Sure his films have their share of fans, sure you can't please everyone, but the boxoffice performances of both his films are showing that his films are TOO divisive.
It just shows that controversy doesn't always guarantee boxoffice or good publicity.
Yeah, they made money, but they're not hitting Marvel numbers and their word of mouth. I know word-of-mouth is a hard thing to quantify, but both of his films suffered disastrously large percentages in the 2nd weekend, which to me is indicative of less than stellar word-of-mouth. And neither one of his superhero movies hit the coveted $1 billion club.
I think MOS was a let down, but the DC universe was salvageable and he had a chance to right the ship with BvS, and it seems to have pissed off fans and critics even worse than before. That he's being allowed to touch Justice League must be a Public Relations compromise of some kind. To get rid of Snyder outright is to admit defeat, just like rebooting Superman AGAIN after MOS would've been admitting defeat.
So what did they do? They threw in the kitchen sink---Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, Lex, Doomsday and blatantly gave away spoilers of every kind in the trailers. And they STILL couldn't make it happen.
Can you imagine if they had a Wolverine, Spiderman, and Iron Man team up movie and it was received like BvS? Feige would be lynched. Batman and Superman are arguably the most famous and popular superheroes of all time. They virtually launched modern day comic books well before Marvel.
And you're telling me a modern day movie teaming them up for the first time couldn't beat a third Captain America?
Unacceptable.
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Post by EnriqueH on May 14, 2016 20:19:37 GMT -5
Ha, if you're referring to 2012 to present day, yes.
I did see a couple of Arrow episodes that I enjoyed, though.
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Post by EnriqueH on May 14, 2016 0:58:16 GMT -5
Ok not gonna say right or wrong. Opinions are opinions people are free to like what they want. That wasnt the issue but the way those opinions were expressed while others were suppressed was. I think we had every right to criticize MOS for what we saw as its flaws without being told to shut up about it. Like I said before I do feel a sense of vindication because I felt Snyders approach was of poor quality and flawed and would hurt WB's plans for a series of DC films and so far it has. Snyder isn't a story guy or a character guy and that's what these movies need. The brand has been damaged even if to a small extent and going forward many people ARE trepidatious. There's a real possibility of Justice League making less than BvS. Many people feel burned. Some feel burned twice and aren't going to put themselves in a position for that to happen again. Now Justice league could be amazing and turn all that around but it'll have to look mind blowingly good in the trailers. Justice league doesn't have the built in name value as batman and superman even thought it's all their top characters together. If you say Justice league to the average person on the streets they aren't going to be able to tell you nearly as much. Honestly speaking, Marvel has 'ruined' things for DC just by the raising the bar so, so high in showing what can and should be done in bringing superhero comics to the big screen. If it wasn't for Marvel (and Singer's Xmen and Raimi's Spiderman), I probably would be far more supportive of Snyder's work on superhero films- but only because I'd have the 'well, it's better than NUTHIN' attitude. Instead- my feeling is: "you've got EVERY resource in the world at your fingertips- as well as a model on how to do it right- HOW can you possibly muck it up???" I think there's a better than average possibility of Justice League making less than BvS. Reasons: 1- Whoever didn't like BvS, dunno if they're coming back. 2- "Avengers" was a breakthrough 'first' that had never been done before. Even Avengers 2 didn't do as well boxofficewise. To have JLA be about a superhero group comes REALLY late if it wants to coast on being a novelty. ((Not to mention X-men: Days of Future Past's mix and match of superheroes already getting there as well.)) 3- I don't feel like anyone's really gotten to know any of the characters THAT well to bond with them. Even Batfleck, and I even like what they've done with him. Maybe the Wonder Woman movie will help with JLA (probably will), but still... 4- Some superhero fatigue already lingering on tv and movies that seems to be present. While it's odd to read (maybe they were joking?) the Russos say that BvS's project got them to mention to Feige that it was time to change things up seriously and that's how Civil War started.... I imagine SOMEONE had to figure out ahead of time that things had to evolve or change a bit and not just be a formula.... ((though "Guardians of the Galaxy" and "Antman" definitely aren't 'playing it safe' and I imagine were there long before BvS was in pre-production)) In any case- I think there would be an uphill battle for the audience's attention even if everyone trusted the writing and directing. With there being doubt and not necessarily good will--- well, I have to say- I'd be suprised if Snyder is feeling less pressure. One wonders if Batfleck offered up that he'd be quality control to get the studio to ease up on Snyder- but, you're right: if it sucks, it's Snyder. If it's any good, it'll be attributed to Batfleck. Good post, but I'm going to focus on superhero fatigue. In a way, I think Marvel and DC would do very well to study the history of Star Trek because Star Trek is an important lesson in what to do AND what not to do with your money making franchise. You have all these fun movies, but you also have the TV shows. Now the Marvel movies have lots of good word of mouth, but they have to up their game as far as raising the stakes for these characters so that the MCU franchise feels like it's alive and evolving. With this kind of output, you probably are going to burn audiences out if the stories don't evolve. But I don't see that in the near future. At least Marvel has good will and good word of mouth on its side and their movies are of consistently good quality. However, the bigger issue at present is that I think that there's just so many comic book properties out right now that not all of them can be a hit. You're forcing people to choose. For me, I can tell you that---as much as i wouldn't mind dedicating hours and hours to comic book movies and shows---I can't watch all those superhero shows and have a life at the same time. Agents of SHIELD, Agent Carter, Gotham, Daredevil, Arrow, Flash, Supergirl, a new Punisher is coming out now. AND the movies to go along with it? Holy sh_, man, that's too much! Maybe if I was retired with millions in the bank, I can watch all that, but with a career, wife and family? Forget it. No way can I keep up with all that." Since I don't have time to rewatch movies the way I used to, I have a hard enough time keeping up with the movies. I really, really wanted to see Deadpool and Ant Man, especially Deadpool (I even bought a Deadpool shirt and winter hat before the movie came out) and I just couldn't find the time.
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Post by EnriqueH on May 14, 2016 0:37:27 GMT -5
Even with all this accumalated knowledge, when will these dummies learn to build a wall.
Hi! You should see the wall, they'll be building for months!
Costa del Trump, Donaldville, Obamaberg?. Obamaberg??
MISS PALIIIIIIIIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (doesn't have the same ring to it.)
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Post by EnriqueH on May 9, 2016 12:38:32 GMT -5
I'm not going to lie. I wish we weren't a broken "community". Some of us, on both sides of the argument, really took things too far. I wish people would just shake hands and get back together.
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Post by EnriqueH on May 7, 2016 18:30:17 GMT -5
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Post by EnriqueH on May 7, 2016 18:10:52 GMT -5
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Post by EnriqueH on May 7, 2016 11:34:17 GMT -5
Hey, Zack. I like the red that glows red like our Krypton sun, but not your 2 irritating Superman movies. Make way.
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Post by EnriqueH on May 7, 2016 11:22:13 GMT -5
LOL!!
That he did.
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Post by EnriqueH on May 7, 2016 11:10:07 GMT -5
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Post by EnriqueH on May 5, 2016 10:35:28 GMT -5
When I was last here, I mentioned that I thought Zack Snyder would be phased away following the 2 "disappointing" boxoffice performances of both his tentpole projects, similar to the way Paramount phased out Gene Roddenberry from producer to executive consultant following the "disappointment" of Star Trek: The Motion Picture. But it seems like it's going to be a pretty public thing with James Wan walking away from the DCU. I enjoyed BvS more than MOS, so I was surprised it was so savagely reviewed by critics and fans alike. But then my expectations were pretty low because, as most of you know, I wasn't the biggest fan of the first Zack Snyder Superman movie. Still, in the weeks since I saw it, a lot of things have occurred to me about the film that I didn't think made a lot of sense storywise, i.e. Superman leaving Batman to save Superman's mom from a bunch of normal goons when Superman could've swooped in and done it in under 5 seconds (in fairness, I can't remember if there was Kryptonite in that scene). The death of Superman should've felt poignant and impactful the way Spock died in Wrath of Khan, but I don't think Superman's death rang any emotional bells for the audience---I mean, he's portrayed in a pretty negative light throughout the film, and the flow of the film didn't allow for Superman's sacrifice to feel emotional or very important. If there was one ugly, disappointing moment in BvS, it was the way Jimmy Olsen was brutally murdered in the film. Now don't get me wrong: Killing off Jimmy Olsen didn't bother me in and of itself, but the way it was handled on and off screen made me feel that Zack Snyder not only doesn't seem to respect Superman and his world very much, but also seems to have a certain contempt for the character and his universe. It's as if Snyder were embarrassed about Superman. That may or may not be the case, but that's the perception I have. Some people are ready to burn Zack Snyder at the stake for the 2 films. I'm not feeling that way, but I do feel now---as I did back when I saw MOS---that Snyder was the wrong guy for this assignment. I didn't think his style suited the character, and it's apparent now from the things he says that he's not the biggest fan of the character. I might've given him a lower tier DCU character to handle to see what he could do with that, but it now seems that he's destroyed whatever good will that Nolan Bat films have created for the DC films. It's really unfortunate a higher caliber director with a handle on story and action couldn't have directed the first rebooted Superman movie. Who that person could've, should've, would've been? I couldn't tell you. But I can tell you that Zack Snyder has proven himself to NOT be that person. Sure, you might say, "But you enjoyed BvS" and that would be true, but enjoyment is a matter of degree. I casually enjoyed it, but I should've been blown away. In a day where you have emotional, action packed and flawlessly executed geek films like "Star Wars: The Force Awakens", "The Dark Knight", and "The Avengers" causing emotional earthquakes inside the audience's chests, Zack Snyder's efforts seem more like the excitement you feel when driving over a pothole---quick, fleeting, forgettable. How do feel about Cavill now? Do you think he is the right person to be Superman? Mostly good. I think of him as a Timothy Dalton/Pierce Brosnan type in that I think they were great for the role but were not given great scripts. I know many here feel Dalton was the best, and I did like him, but neither Dalton or Brosnan, IMO, got their own Goldfinger, Spy Who Loved Me or Casino Royale. But I also agree with Metallo: there are moments where he doesn't come across very well. I hate to say this because I have a soft spot for Dalton, but I did feel his performance was occasionally too serious. It was like he thought he was in Casino Royale, but the direction of the movies were a cross between Fleming and leftover Roger Moore material, giving Dalton a sometimes weird feel. But I blame the filmmakers not the actor.
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Post by EnriqueH on May 4, 2016 16:09:30 GMT -5
When I was last here, I mentioned that I thought Zack Snyder would be phased away following the 2 "disappointing" boxoffice performances of both his tentpole projects, similar to the way Paramount phased out Gene Roddenberry from producer to executive consultant following the "disappointment" of Star Trek: The Motion Picture.
But it seems like it's going to be a pretty public thing with James Wan walking away from the DCU.
I enjoyed BvS more than MOS, so I was surprised it was so savagely reviewed by critics and fans alike. But then my expectations were pretty low because, as most of you know, I wasn't the biggest fan of the first Zack Snyder Superman movie.
Still, in the weeks since I saw it, a lot of things have occurred to me about the film that I didn't think made a lot of sense storywise, i.e. Superman leaving Batman to save Superman's mom from a bunch of normal goons when Superman could've swooped in and done it in under 5 seconds (in fairness, I can't remember if there was Kryptonite in that scene). The death of Superman should've felt poignant and impactful the way Spock died in Wrath of Khan, but I don't think Superman's death rang any emotional bells for the audience---I mean, he's portrayed in a pretty negative light throughout the film, and the flow of the film didn't allow for Superman's sacrifice to feel emotional or very important.
If there was one ugly, disappointing moment in BvS, it was the way Jimmy Olsen was brutally murdered in the film. Now don't get me wrong: Killing off Jimmy Olsen didn't bother me in and of itself, but the way it was handled on and off screen made me feel that Zack Snyder not only doesn't seem to respect Superman and his world very much, but also seems to have a certain contempt for the character and his universe. It's as if Snyder were embarrassed about Superman. That may or may not be the case, but that's the perception I have.
Some people are ready to burn Zack Snyder at the stake for the 2 films. I'm not feeling that way, but I do feel now---as I did back when I saw MOS---that Snyder was the wrong guy for this assignment. I didn't think his style suited the character, and it's apparent now from the things he says that he's not the biggest fan of the character. I might've given him a lower tier DCU character to handle to see what he could do with that, but it now seems that he's destroyed whatever good will that Nolan Bat films have created for the DC films.
It's really unfortunate a higher caliber director with a handle on story and action couldn't have directed the first rebooted Superman movie. Who that person could've, should've, would've been? I couldn't tell you. But I can tell you that Zack Snyder has proven himself to NOT be that person.
Sure, you might say, "But you enjoyed BvS" and that would be true, but enjoyment is a matter of degree. I casually enjoyed it, but I should've been blown away. In a day where you have emotional, action packed and flawlessly executed geek films like "Star Wars: The Force Awakens", "The Dark Knight", and "The Avengers" causing emotional earthquakes inside the audience's chests, Zack Snyder's efforts seem more like the excitement you feel when driving over a pothole---quick, fleeting, forgettable.
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Post by EnriqueH on Apr 10, 2016 17:21:41 GMT -5
So I haven't really been following the behind the scenes news, rumors and powerplaying surrounding the DC Universe, so I'm curious what I supposed to happen from here besides a Wonder Woman and Aquaman movie.
I understand Zack Snyder is scheduled to produce/direct others? Is that right?
I'm curious because it now seems that BvS is fading fast at the boxoffice and will be even less profitable than MOS, which was itself considered a disappointment by superhero/Marvel/blockbuster standards.
I have to imagine that Snyder may be secretly in the hot seat: both of his major DC projects had huge percentage drops following the 2nd weekend, both movies are divisive among the fan base, and this last seemed to be getting worse reviews and publicity. But to make matters worse, the publications are claiming BvS is even less profitable than MOS?
That can't be good for Snyder.
They clearly brought in Batman as a PR damage control following the lukewarm boxoffice of MOS (by studio expectations), and now that they have thrown everything plus the kitchen sink into this movie, (Batman, Wonder Woman, Lex Luthor, Doomsday) it's STILL going to disappoint if I'm understanding the pundits?
I kinda suspect Snyder will be phased out, or given a ceremonial title like what happened to Gene Roddenberry following Star Trek: The Motion Picture when he was taken out of the produer's role and given the title of "executive consultant" after TMP became a similarly divisive movie that did well, but not as strong as hoped.
In fact, I read a headline this last week stating that Snyder is "supporting" Ben Affleck in the director's chair for future Batman movies. I have to suspect that the phasing out might be starting?
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Post by EnriqueH on Apr 3, 2016 22:29:26 GMT -5
It's funny I just saw Ilya Salkind's reaction on the Internet a couple of days ago and he said about MOS, "It was ok. I thought it was a little too Batman-ish."
Now that I think about it, I just said Snyder should get away from making superhero movies, but you know what? I might be ok with Snyder directing a Batman movie. His Batman was executed much better than his Superman material.
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Post by EnriqueH on Apr 3, 2016 22:26:48 GMT -5
That was Jimmy getting shot in the head?
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Post by EnriqueH on Apr 3, 2016 21:41:21 GMT -5
I haven't seen MOS a second time since it came out in theaters, so I can't really think of anything in the first film.
Having just seen BvS, I can definitely say: Batman.
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Post by EnriqueH on Apr 3, 2016 21:36:49 GMT -5
The first reaction when I read the title of the subject is an unequivocal, "Yes."
If repeat viewings mean you enjoy the movie more, it matters. Similarly, if repeat viewings draws out crushing flaws, and you like the movie less, it also matters.
Ideally, you watch the movie and enjoy it more with repeat viewings. That happened to me with Batman Begins, The Matrix and (one day I hope the same thing will happen with Man of Steel).
Movies I liked less with repeat viewings:
Attack of the Clones (but I still like it) The Man With the Golden Gun (again, I still like it) Batman Forever (enjoyed it for what it was at first and saw it a few more times. Having seen it again in recent years, and it was actually quite painful to watch in segments.) Superman Returns (I still enjoy it, but the flaws are glaring in your face.)
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Post by EnriqueH on Apr 3, 2016 21:30:11 GMT -5
I appreciate the welcome, guys.
Too bad the old crew isn't here since I'd be kinda curious to read their reactions to the film. I'm particularly curious if the big MOS fans were equally enthused about BvS. I found that some of the people I know in person that liked MOS didn't like this one as much, or at all, but the people I know that didn't like MOS very much seemed to like this one better.
Anyway, I'm curious if they really did trim a lot of Superman out of the movie.
What did you guys think of Doomsday? I've heard a lot of people say that Doomsday reminded them too much of Abomination from "The Incredible Hulk" movie. I kinda see why, but that didn't bug me that much. I was more bothered by the overall writing of the Superman sections of the film.
The big finish, which should've hit an emotional crescendo, didn't feel like that big bang finish that it should've felt like. The feeling I get from Luke saying "NEVER!" and the music that followed his beatdown of Vader during the emotional climax of the original Star Wars trilogy, or the emotion that I felt when Superman screamed like a maniac when Lois died in STM. I don't know how you would describe that feeling, but I think that's the emotion that was missing during Superman's moment in BvS. Interestingly, I felt it when Batman beat Superman and screamed, "How do you know that name?!" but I didn't feel it at the climax.
On a separate note, prior to watching the film, I heard some criticisms that Batman killed people. Given the way they handled Superman killing Zod in MOS , I wasn't surprised, but did that happen outside the dream sequence in BvS? If so, I didn't remember it (and I didn't even go to the bathroom). Was it a "blink and you'll miss it" moment? Or maybe it was kinda like Batman "killing" the Joker's goons when he blew up Axis Chemicals---yeah, I guess you can say "Batman killed", but you also kinda pretend he didn't. "
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Post by EnriqueH on Apr 3, 2016 14:06:09 GMT -5
I enjoyed it, even though there were things in the story that could've been better.
1) I liked how the movie took one of MOS's criticisms---Superman destroying everything---and turned it into a potential strength for this movie. However, the storyline didn't really come full circle IMO, but elegant story depth, subtext and drama are not Snyder's forte. And that is unfortunate because I feel both MOS and BvS had the potential to be deeper movies than they came across, but delivering that subtext is lost on Snyder's style. I'm still not convinced Snyder knows how to handle Superman. He still comes across as sort of aloof. I heard that his screen time was axed big time, so maybe that's why, but the "Superman destroys everything" controversy didn't seem sufficiently handled. Thank God for the scenes between Cavill and Amy Adams, since they're the only scenes indicate that Superman is "human" at all IMO.
2) While I fully expected Superman to be demoted to 2nd banana after the "disappointment" of MOS's boxoffice, some of the decisions as to what Batman and Superman would do seemed strange. Why is Batman rescuing Superman's mom? Maybe I missed something, but that seemed like a strange story decision. If Superman was so concerned with his mom, like I know he was, how could he focus on doing something else and leave the rescuing up to Batman. I don't care how much Superman trusts Batman, I think anyone would want to oversee that rescue themselves. Maybe there's a good reason for this, and I need to see the movie again, but I can't remember what else Superman had to do that was so pressing that he couldn't rescue his own mom, especially since all it entailed was beating up a bunch of thugs. It would seem to me that Superman could've handled that crew in 2 seconds and saved Batman the trouble---but then we would've lost a really badass Batman fight sequence.
Some people may have trouble with Batman replacing Superman in scenes like where he confronts Superman's arch nemesis at the end, or replacing Superman as a potential lover for Wonder Woman. I liked that Batman confronted Lex Luthor and had a chemistry with Wonder Woman because that seemed like something new and different. But Batman rescuing Superman's mom was a strange decision.
Despite the story problems, I completely enjoyed the cast.
1) Thought Ben Affleck was a phenomenal Batman. I didn't like him as much as Christian Bale, but I think he just might have surpassed Michael Keaton. I hope he gets to play him again. Although I thought the movie would be horrible (and I was wrong), I predicted Affleck would be the best thing about the movie, and I think that has been proven true. Affleck was fantastic.
2) I enoyed Henry Cavill, but like in MOS, Snyder doesn't know how to update him effectively for full impact. Superman has been shortchanged again, but that is not Cavill's fault. His tenure as Superman is beginning to remind me of the James Bond tenures for actors Timothy Dalton and Pierce Brosnan, who were both great Bonds, but neither were able to star in a truly great Bond film.
3) I ended up enjoying Jesse Eisenberg's performance even though I fully expected it be a disaster of epic proportions. Not sure how Lex in the comics is portrayed these days, but I was hoping for CEO Lex of the 90s early 00s. Instead we seemed to get a sort of Riddlerized version of Lex. Indeed, the way the scene ended made me feel like Lex was a last minute replacement for Riddler/Joker. Still, Eisenberg transcended all that. (And did anyone get the similarity between Lex creating Doomsday and Nuclear Man? Thought obviously better than Superman IV, I thought there was a funny lesson there somewhere since Superman IV like Snyder's Superman movies are good ideas done badly.
Overall, I thought the movie started a bit too slow, and got better in the second half. (The opposite was true of MOS, IMO, which started well and had a second half that was less than.)
I've been a big Snyder defender over the years, even though I didn't like MOS very much, and BvS has done little to convince me that he has a bright future with these kinds of films. I think he needs to get out of the director's chair for future superhero movies. I've come to realize what bugged me about MOS and BvS is that both movies had potentially great scripts that come across as rough drafts onscreen. Deep storylines and subtext seems lost on Snyder's style. I think both movies had the potential to be as great as Dark Knight, but this kind of story isn't Snyder's forte. He's a visual guy. He would be great directing 80s style action films like Cobra, Commando or similar action films that are all about brawn, oneliners and cool stuff with no depth.
There may have been a time when superhero movies might've been like that, but they've evolved. I think many comic book fans want the dramatic, Oscar worthy story depth to go along with all the cool stuff blowing up. And Snyder is not the guy to be delivering the deep storylines.
So overall, I enjoyed it and look forward to watching it again. But looking at it as a Superman fan? It wasn't kind to Superman. While there have been fun and successful Superman shows, the silver screen hasn't been so good. Superman Returns was supposed to be Superman's triumphant return and that didn't happen. MOS was supposed to be Superman's big return, and that didn't happen. And now here we have the 3rd Superman movie in 10 years, and it still didn't quite get people excited about Superman. I hope Cavill's Superman finds critical and boxoffice redemption. He's a good torch bearer for Superman and deserves a better Superman movie.
Meanwhile, we'll just have to try and enjoy what we do have.
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Post by EnriqueH on Oct 15, 2015 16:35:48 GMT -5
I don't know.
I've had Alex S as a FaceBook friend for years, even after I came here following the "big split".
However, even though I was a member of the community since 1999, somehow all the "big, epic dramas" eluded me since I was never involved directly. To this day, I'm not quite sure what the heck happened with Fabio and some of our past female members, nor am I very clear about what happened with Alex's forum vs. Maverick's forum. All I know is I kinda went with the flow. Of course, this last time, I was in the center of the hurricane, so I kinda know what happened there.
Is Guru with the Facebook group? I haven't heard from him in ages and was wondering about him but it could be he was part of the mass exodus. I feel as though he was very quiet throughout the MOS build up and release (in fact, I believe he said he wouldn't watch it, I think). Anyway, I was wondering if he was alright.
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